Does anyone know if the Affluent Ritual applies during EOWCF?
Printable View
Does anyone know if the Affluent Ritual applies during EOWCF?
I know the Onslaught ritual takes over 5 million runes. I don't think it's worthwhile, and I know we don't have the runes for it now anyways. I might try it for OOWP and let you know though! I will say that oowp might be the only time that they're possible for a warring KD. I started an Onslaught ritual, but abandoned it right away because it takes 100 casts @ 5200 runes per cast!
I know math is hard, but come on.Quote:
Originally Posted by Crazyguy
Whatever. It might as well be a billion. You're missing the point.
520000 runes / 5 days = 104000 runes / day
104000 runes / 22 provinces = 4728 runes / province / day
So, in previous ages it would have been impossible to paradise more than 2-3 times per day? Its expensive, but I wouldn't say its prohibitive.
The hard part is getting 22+ people to work toward the same goal, I suppose, and thus organized KDs can and should benefit more from KRs.
No war only(confirmed by devs pre age). If it was it would be mandatory that's why they limit it. EOWCF is a good time to save runes for a new ritual :).Quote:
Originally Posted by changeling
thats wrong bo to.....affluent SHOULD work in eowcf
edit.......read post below im wrong
*Should not. Affluent is designed to be war only, per the changes.
Lol oh really, I misunderstood that one, too. Thought it was like a EoWCF only type of thing. Either way I question its usefulness.
I don't see the logic of "it would become mandatory" if available in CF... Yes, every KD that could do it, would use it. Any KD who couldn't would be SoL. Plus the fact that Once EowCF ends "War" status should cease, and the KR would be cancelled... You invest for 120h and can get an abosolute MAX of 73h out of a CF. I thought this seemed like a fair compromise.
To me the only time Affluent would be used is if you are dominating a War already and need to start dumping Dragons, or for the CF... and really the former wouldn't be a great use.
During actual War, the cost of KR seems prohibitive unless the enemy is basically crushed already and refusing to go away.
If you preload Affluent(you dont want to pump it out last second and enter war with no runes or mana) to use during War, or even in CF(I dont see it being viable to cast KR vs offensive spells DURING war), that means you aren't able to use Onslaught or Barrier in the opening of your war, which I would think would be the best investment of your KR, generally...
What I am getting at is that if Affluent isn't available during EoWCF, I don't really see a use for it. If you go to use it(Affluent) in War, it precludes you from using the other two. Sure the other two have uses outside of War scenario, but it seems trivial by comparison.
I thought just like you and got disappointed :).Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffT
I think the cost of different KRs should be different just like the cost of dragons. 50(A), 75(O), 100(B) casts.
Err... EOWCF is still WAR.
Thats weak development; eowcf i still war stance
No, I'm not. I don't believe hyperbole is applicable because it just isn't true. Our kingdom came OOP and had our ritual ready within 8 ticks of OOP. Not hard, we just made a plan for it. We worked together. Other people have posted similar things. Work together as a team and you will be fine. Sun Tzu would say something like - "The opponent beat you before the battle even started".Quote:
Originally Posted by Crazyguy
But end of war ceasefire IS war? Unless you guys suddenly decided to change the narrative that has been established for X ages since eowcf existed... undocumented changes much?Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffT
Either that or you deliberately misled the player-base with your wording there mate.
I don't think it was deliberate--there would be no point in tricking players into completing a pointless ritual. But it was misleading. All war conditions persist in EOWCF unless specifically exempted, so this certainly needs some clarification.
Definitely talked the squad into going heavy towers pregame since we had a war arranged. Burned the whole team there.
I suppose your right but both Zauper and Hawk are well immersed in the utopia zeitgeist. they are well aware that war = eowcf, so for them to not make that qualifying distinction is dubious at best.Quote:
Originally Posted by Andurilas
Can you perform Propaganda during EoWCF? No, because you are no longer at war. You are in war stance, but not at war.
EoWCF is already providing bonuses. There is no need to stack additional bonuses on some Kingdoms that are organized enough to cast the KR. If we wanted to buff EoWCF we could have just done that instead of providing bonuses to some Kingdoms instead of all.
The goal of the WAR only KR is to provide a new strategic element to warring, not add buffs to EoWCF pumping. All the scenarios I see listed in this thread regarding the reasons the KR can't be cast appear to me to be consciously made choices to not perform the KR. You have the option, as does every Kingdom, of stockpiling runes before a war (same as gc, mana, stealth, soldiers). If you have 25 provinces (the goal of every Kingdom should be to have 25 provinces otherwise that is another active conscious choice made that has strategic consequences) and you stockpile your mana and runes and also take advantage of the new Propose War feature that allows you to enter war directly without long drawn out Hostiles, you should have 2250 mana available to your Kingdom (plus 25 * 1 spell cast since 2250 would only bring you down to 10 mana and you get 1 more cast). A KR requires 500 mana to complete if you are casting it the first 2 spells while at 100 mana (this could be much less if you use it as the last casts, but for argument's sake we'll go with the higher amount). You are essentially suggesting that +25% income, +20% Birth Rate and +25% increased draft speed for the next 120 hours is not worth ~20% of your Kingdom's mana? 30% if you all fail 1x (2x and you remove the extra spell I've accounted for at 10% mana). I feel you may want to re-consider your war planning if that is the case, not to mention the fact that the ritual can't be removed this age. I would suggest you compare the pro's and con's one more time for this age while you have free 120 hour rituals because they will likely be destroyable next age!
Now, I'm sure the next post I will see is: "Our opponent has Affluent KR making it near impossible for us to beat them with no way to remove it and no way to cast our own now that we're already in war and theirs is up!"
It's a new strategic tool for you to take advantage of if you so choose. It is your choice alone whether you want to use it or not. I'll give you this piece of advice though, how many times are your faery going to cast ToG in war? How many times will you cast L&P in war? How many times will you cast Patriotism in war? Every tick of Affluent is a free ToG for every single province, and every 12 ticks in war is a free cast of L&P AND Patriotism for the entire Kingdom. From that perspective it would seem you've recovered the mana 'lost' by casting it after the first 12 hours? At most by 24 hours...and you have it on you for another 96 hours (if your war drags out?).
Anyway, good luck with your decision making :) I hope this helps!
Yes you can perform propaganda during EoWCF I've done it in the split seconds of lag before the game realizes a kingdom has surrendered, what prevents you is the additional conditions that EoWCF provides which are above and beyond all other stances (preventing all ops/attacks, starting of dragons, or sending of CFs), but never was EoWCF ever considered it's own stance. If you really force me to I can probably dig up Zauper's own words somewhere on this forum where he has said as much.Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidC
Don't ToG, mana and runes at a premium and the only one who can ToG is faery which is wearing a 2 piece gimp suit a la -5% pop and -10% income.
Don't pat, mana and runes at a premium and attackers dont have peasants to draft from anyway.
Dont LP. Peasants are the devils children, causes you to overpop harder.
This is war on 99% of the server.
I would rather the barrier ritual in pretty much all situations. It seems like you created the affluent ritual for a small subset of the game.
Even so, the fact remains, it would have been exceedingly simple to add an additional qualifier to the description of the affluent ritual "Does not work in EoWCF"... you know the W stands for war right?
Sorry for the snark, but you're being rather patronizing.
So you cant do it. If the game dont recognize a surrender yet there is no eowcf. If you could it in eowcf you wouldnt need the criteria you mention to do it. Why cant you attack the other kingdom in eowcf? Why is there a name specific for it if it just war?Why do you suddenly have different amount of bonuses that you didnt have previously i+f its just war stance? How does that work, i mean how can stance have two different set of bonuse depending on when its in the war?Quote:
Yes you can perform propaganda during EoWCF I've done it in the split seconds of lag before the game realizes a kingdom has surrendered, what prevents you is the additional conditions that EoWCF provides which are above and beyond all other stances (preventing all ops/attacks, starting of dragons, or sending of CFs), but never was EoWCF ever considered it's own stance. If you really force me to I can probably dig up Zauper's own words somewhere on this forum where he has said as much.
i dont disagree with you, but this is the what has been spouted since eowcf existed. i'm just asking for consistency especially when it comes to the things that are left unsaidQuote:
Originally Posted by Korp
Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidC
ofc EOWCF is war and Affluent ritual should work there. that ritual is useless in war and noone will use it. Just remove it if you can`t use it in EOWCF. why stances don`t work in EOWCF? because it is war.
you can`t expect people to guess how you program the game. to waste huge amount of runes and time to build and raze a lot towers and in the end to say it not working in EOWCF
It seems that everyone has accepted that eowcf is treated differently than the war itself since forever as people should have figured out that it wouldnt apply either then since its not war its End of WAR CF. People seem in general happy with things when its benficial with them but as soon is turns to negative people start to *****. Should scrap the whole eowcf.Quote:
Originally Posted by Selephant
If its war why cant you attack your enemy then? IF ITS WAR WHY CANT WE DO THESE THINGS THEN?!? Please explain that to me.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bayhuy
Ffs why u play with the changes.. from ur own words when u brought this up
") Prosperity (EoWCF ONLY) - Increases income by 25%, Birth Rate by 20%, and draft speed by 25%
3) Offensive - Increases OME by 10% and enemy casualties on your offensive attacks by 15%
Note: The Prosperity KR can be initiated and completed at any time regardless of your stance (relations) however, if it is active and you are NOT in EoWCF you will receive no effects from it.
The goal here is to give t/ms something they can do outside of conflict that generates benefit for the kingdom, and give kingdoms another tool to help them recover rapidly on top of the EOW bonus.
So the goal here now is to... what? Screw kds who finished this expensive sh!t eowcf prep.
Great work what can I say...
You should learn the difference between Proposed age changes and Final age changes.Quote:
Originally Posted by cRs
No.. u turned this game into genesis.. and now playing with words like eowcf is not war and that the rk is not needed into eowcf and so on. As I suggested X times start the damn genesis server and dont screw this game using it for failed tests.
There is no prosperity ritual since that was in the Proposed changes, you do know what Proposed means dont you? If you look in the Final age changes you can see its changed to Affluent instead.Quote:
Originally Posted by cRs
So if its war how come you cannot attack in eowcf cRs? Man, this is a huge bug that you cant attack in war, why havent you brought this earlier? Its a ****ing game breaking bug and nobody has said anything about it.
Also I am just a poster like others.
Thanks for the clearification that it is ment for war not warending, I think I understood the other thing first.
it is an awefully lot of runes, but I guess it comes down to wether or not the kingdom can pull this off and if using the runes for something else would have been more benificial, it is the same for dragons, if you only fund 90% it will not have any effect.
Well they sure have nice ideologies.
25 prov kds. Full team work and 24/7 activity.
Just like I want world peace and go to space. Both of which according to devs are easy if we want it.
Lucky some of lives in the real world.
Tbh I think I speak of many that atm think you are clowns.
You remove the race that is now #1 played. You introduce paladins but no protection to them.
Dryads was an even bigger last beer age idea?
If you truly want to have 25 ppl kingdoms, more co operation and increase the competition then focus on the right things.
Bring a friend, easier recruting, easier coms and make it f**king responsive with HTML5.
My iPhone still cant write in the forum. Or maybe 1/100 works in game.
Make a plan and stick to it good or bad. But stop bullying the people who makes utopia great.
Its all about the community. Update the guide, make formulas and then we can take decisions based on that.
Updating gains and informing that this doesnt work a few days in, is just low. Could have waited to next age. Test stuff pls.
U can attack in eowcf, u can op, u can steal, u can explore, u can do whateva u want but with big penalty cuz why? YOU ARE IN WAR PROTECTION. So stop explaining a fcking mistake of the devs for not explaining this properlly... or atlleast find a good way of doing itQuote:
Originally Posted by Korp
No, you cant attack your opponent, you see the eowcf the last two letters, consist of Cease Fire, do you know what Ceasefire means? That means you cant attack your opponent cause you are in a CF. That I have to exlain basic **** like this for someone that supposedly comes from a warring kd is absurd.Quote:
Originally Posted by cRs
Wtf we are in EOWCF but on kingdom page is written This kingdom is currently at war with ...... Stances don't work guess why? Because we are in war. Rest have -75% gains on use why? Because we are in war.
Then go attack your opponent why would you not attack at all in war, that sounds utterly dumb strategy to me.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bayhuy
@korp
If we are not in war.
Why are our gains oow -75% on other kds?
I mean we are in CF with one KD and you are obviously stating we are not in war.
Korp none is taking you seriously any more, stop spamming every thread there is for the sake of it.
Well first of all I would like you to explain how you cant attack the kingdom you are in war with? If you are in war how come you cant do that? And then I liked you to explain how come you have a different set of bonus suddenly? How does that work? People are in eowcf, seperate part of the war. If you want to be consisten and claim you are in war you should bring up all these problems as well. But since none has thought of that until you missing out on something that is beneficial for your kingdom it seems rather stupid all in all.Quote:
Originally Posted by Manslayer
OT again.
There are 3 stances and 2 kd status in this game.
You can be aggressive, normal and fortified at any time.
They are affective oow but can still be changed in war.
Thus 3 stances and 2 kd status.
EOWCF is in war or out of war. Period.
There is no magic land status in between.
In war there is a -75% penalty to and from other kingdoms.
So:
1) if we are not at war, why is there such a penalty in eowcf?
2) what ridicolous status will you make up now?
I still think you are clowns.
There is logic and there are assumptions.
You are making us guess some logic that applies in war suddenly does not?
Are we at war or not? There are either yes or no. If no then all other penalties should also go away.
EOWCF is a CF bonus between 2 kds at war? Yes?
So the bonus is only applied between 2 kds in war after CF is signed?
That means that the KDs are still at war with a CF when the bonus is triggered.
But we are... Not... In war ... When the ritual does with same criteria?
This logic is ridicolous. One logic says "yes yes I give bonus after CF because you are at war" and other says "War? No fk off"
@korp
We are not. Its a CF. Its treated like all CFs.
So far very logical. But we have war penalties. So its also very logical to assume we are still in war.
Otherwise the penalty isnt there.
This is only a discission on when war ends.
You cant negative war effects oow and claiming the positive ones are for war only.
They have to decide if war is on or off. And remove or gain all effects.
Korp you owner or just spammer? Stop complaining like young girl. Eowcf is war. Make it clear that this ritual not work in eowcf and don't screw kingdoms who read changes careful and try to play whit them.
I think that all this discussion about ops/attacks is irrelevant since the main discussion is Kingdom Rituals - Affluence.
Let's look at rituals again:
1) Barrier - Increases defensive TPA and WPA by 25%; reduces gains via attacks against the kingdom by 10% (similar to Guard Stations); +10% DME
2) Affluent (WAR ONLY) - Increases income by 25%, Birth Rate by 20%, and draft speed by 25%
3) Onslaught - Increases OME by 10% and enemy casualties on your offensive attacks by 15%
If the Affluent won't work in eowcf, i don't see a reason why anybody should pick it, since it only affects kingdoms in "pure" wars. Why should i choose Affluent when i have the other 2, which are more war oriented, affecting OME, DME, TPA, WPA etc.? Why would you spend a huge amount of runes in 48 hours (which means a huge amount of runes burned right before war), when for half of the kingdom minimum, the effects of the ritual won't matter? Why wouldn't anyone choose it when they have the other two?
I honestly expected it to be designed for eowcf, when you have 20-25 provinces in bad shape, to speed things up.