Fratzia vs ED

[Elit]

Its funny how elit is on this side of the argument, seening how he got screwed out of a crown by this exact same logic, when he tried to "dodge" havoc.

AMA never try to dodge Havoc, We was in our prepare set for war them when second ABS kd = Sanctuary start mess with us for prevent AMA prepare and war Havoc in 1 vs1.
In short ABS was hell lame with double hostile us, but its was result from invite ghetto ppl lead Havoc = goodz. After it more n00bs pop and try play in top: Petrified (pew pew) and Part+goodz (ED). So we have now crap game full with lame ****s because incompetent people lead kds.
Why its so hard for people compete proper? Play 1vs1 and when you cant war some one trade land for CF how was done all past ages.

[Elit]

13nesta13, im not really blame Pyro because im consider your kd for n00bs in land chart and you dont know how its work. Posting your guilty is 50% is to show you result from your decision. Yes its ok for opeple to make new deals and extend them. This dont hurt any one direct, but its not ok when 2 KDs have CF and they drop it so one from KDs can run from other kd. This make direct DMG to another kd and its unfair+abuse. Set your CFs proper is one from most important skills in top. If every one can drop all his cfs any time for run from other we will have what we have now= people start hit in war for get what they can get in fair 1vs1 fight. I don't see how this run help ED when Fratzia is hit them.

About WW chart. We cant be sure if you can win or not in fair 1vs1 war with ED but its clear you can win now with ED take much hits OOW. So basically your win is not result from your work only but its result from ED got hits OOW. I don't see how its fair to rest WW kds won his wars in 1vs1.

[munk]

elit dodges fights all the time. He didnt want round 2 last age, so he threatened with 2v1... lame :P

[Handym@n]

I just feel that it's the current dynamics of the gameplay that is causing all these. There's no proper system on what to do when Kingdom A notice Kingdom B, and Kingdom B knows they will farm out to Kingdom A, hence what should Kingdom B do?

-cJ

simple.. trade acres for CF. its been like that all along.

[Elit]

elit dodges fights all the time. He didnt want round 2 last age, so he threatened with 2v1... lame :P

Its was Havoc = munk+zauper play lame with us last age. First you told we can cf, after 24h lzauper confirm it: yes most like we will cf, and several hours later he come and reject it. So basically we had left 2.5 days for prepare vs 4 days for you. Considering what did Havoc to us age before it i think GB was better from 2vs1 :P

I don't know why you cant do your deals proper and not disappear for 30h middle diplo and change deal/terms complete after it.

[munk]

Its was Havoc = munk+zauper play lame with us last age. First you told we can cf, after 24h lzauper confirm it: yes most like we will cf, and several hours later he come and reject it. So basically we had left 2.5 days for prepare vs 4 days for you. Considering what did Havoc to us age before it i think GB was better from 2vs1 :P

I don't know why you cant do your deals proper and not disappear for 30h middle diplo and change deal/terms complete after it.

<3 <3

[Elit]

<3 <3

Call me stupid but i <3 <3 you too ;)

[Lykron]

I already told Elit, I have no problem if 2-3 kds come and raze the acres we took from ED so we don;t look like playing unfair VS rest of top kds and took acres from a kd that doesn't fight back BUT that has to come together with the same kds agreeing that this has to STOP and that playing has to be normal and natural and these that do stuff like pewpew and ED by pushing the rules to where they suit them have to be punished by all rest and eventually by the admins.

prove that by razing the acres you got from ED and it will be +1. until then, taking the moral highground, it's just another excuse to farm free acres for yourself.

[Avenger]

ED is lame to dodge fratzia, but fratzia is even lamer to hit into war. The end.

/thread

[Shai]

Lets eat the pies instead of keep throwing them at each others

ED running from a war was lame
Pyro helping ED run from a war to get an easy win was lame
Fratzia waving ED into a real war, even thou it was arranged was lame


Like someone said, its all lame. I think most people that arent overly biased can agree on that.

I can understand why ED ran, and why Pyro helped ED, and why Fratzia waved ED. But it doesnt make any of it right.

I do agree with one thing the dude from Pyro wrote. This CF thing needs to stop. Arranged war is just a natural product of the CF game getting out of hand. Its hard to arrange a war and run from someone when u dont have 2-3 days to look for one.

In the end I guess its all those kds doing the CF game that are to blame for this. Utopians are no different then others, they will find ways to avoid conflicts if they see no chance of winning or gaining from it. They way the CF game is set up, it allows for arranged wars to a much larger extent, and thats why we are starting to see them in the top now as well.

When there was no CF game going on, people ran to fake wars after being waved or if they anticipated a wave. Now people arrange wars when they know someone is coming for them because they have the time to do so. Thats how it is, people will always find ways to avoid a conflict if they are desperate and if its possible to do so to a smaller loss.

Personally I see nothing wrong with arranging wars. Its well within the rules. But there is also within the rules to farm out, to gangbang provinces and/or kingdoms and to powerplay weaker kingdoms. So if someone get mad at people for arranging wars, you either accept that, or do something about it. Just like you do with all the other things mentioned two sentences up.

Usually there is a reaction within the utopian community when something is going on that the majority think is lame, and then there will be actions against it, and then generally that thing stops cause people realize the price is too high to pay.

We already starting to see some reactions to arranged wars: we saw some last age with SWEA and AMA hitting into wars, and we now saw it with Fratzia hitting into a war. Eventually more kds will feel they are entitled to hit into arranged wars and then we'll probably see alot less of them. That is how Utopia work.

Or if more people think arranging wars are fine and hitting into them arent, then we will start to see the kds hitting into arranged wars being punished, and then they will do that to a lesser extent.

So in the end it will just come down to what the utopian community think is more or less wrong. It will be interesting to see what happens in this case.

[Handym@n]

i agree on arranging war is legit.. but the way ED uses 'arranged war' is somewhat in the nature of FW or dodging/running away from other KDs that has claim to them. usually an arranged war, both KDs are well prepared and pumped so they can really test their set-up vs the other, and its fun that way. but their arranged war was something a joke, some EDs prov has 13k+ untrained sols? why RUSH going in if its arranged anyway?

[Elit]

Shai, i agree its lame situation and its loss for all kds involved. But we was put in same situation last age and this age. Both ages from same kd Pew Pew. There is not perfect Solution when its hapend. Hit in war is really bad, but what we did last age was correct and what did Fratzia this age vs ED is correct too. This is not first run from ED its 3 times in raw. WTF is this? Its total abuse all.

CFs is not problem if you don't CF wrong kds. After last age We don't CF more Pew Pew and after this age There wont be CFs for ED. If all rest kds make same they cant manipulate game more and cant keep run. CFs are in first place for let 2 kds prepare and war in relative fair terms. Its don't mean you will get even war. Land chart is all about build advantage and use it in 1vs1 war vs other kd for gain land. Its ok if you go in another legit war, but after got notice you wont have 48/72h for prepare when war is over so its risk move. If ED gone in war with pyro 24h before his notice expire from Fratzia there wont be hits oow, for simple reason Fratzia wont break his deal + wont have trained his army. If you want to run make it proper. Going in war 1h before notice expire is asking to get waved.

[Shai]

Shai, i agree its lame situation and its loss for all kds involved. But we was put in same situation last age and this age. Both ages from same kd Pew Pew. There is not perfect Solution when its hapend. Hit in war is really bad, but what we did last age was correct and what did Fratzia this age vs ED is correct too. This is not first run from ED its 3 times in raw. WTF is this? Its total abuse all.

CFs is not problem if you don't CF wrong kds. After last age We don't CF more Pew Pew and after this age There wont be CFs for ED. If all rest kds make same they cant manipulate game more and cant keep run. CFs are in first place for let 2 kds prepare and war in relative fair terms. Its don't mean you will get even war. Land chart is all about build advantage and use it in 1vs1 war vs other kd for gain land. Its ok if you go in another legit war, but after got notice you wont have 48/72h for prepare when war is over so its risk move. If ED gone in war with pyro 24h before his notice expire from Fratzia there wont be hits oow, for simple reason Fratzia wont break his deal + wont have trained his army. If you want to run make it proper. Going in war 1h before notice expire is asking to get waved.

I think this might be the first time I agree with almost everything you wrote ;), except for the fact that its OK to hit into a real war cause the other party is running. Its not OK. Just as its not OK to jump into an arranged war one hour before notice expires.

But like u said, this arranged wars thing could be handled much better. Like you also said, had ED jumped into that arranged war 24h earlier or even 16h earlier Fratzia would probably not have trained and rebuild and just gone for someone else a few days later. Jumping into war 1h before notice expired when the other kd have trained up and switched builds and ruined their pump is kinda asking to get waved. I know last age Mansoor said the exact same thing. If the other kd makes em train up and switch builds just for them, he will wave no matter what.

[Runefire]

Just as its not OK to jump into an arranged war one hour before notice expires.

But like u said, this arranged wars thing could be handled much better. Like you also said, had ED jumped into that arranged war 24h earlier or even 16h earlier Fratzia would probably not have trained and rebuild and just gone for someone else a few days later. Jumping into war 1h before notice expired when the other kd have trained up and switched builds and ruined their pump is kinda asking to get waved. I know last age Mansoor said the exact same thing. If the other kd makes em train up and switch builds just for them, he will wave no matter what.

I don't see the difference between 24 hours and 1 hour, as long as it is before end of the deal, it is legitimate. I see this as a risk you take for making a notice deal.

If you think they will run, offer a new deal and don't train up. Or train and do something else. Or leave it open and see if you can jump them another time, or risk them doing the same to you.

[padrez]

imo both ED and PewPew have lost the battle for crown since long ago. so why not mess up the charts. while everyone interested is raging about what they do or do not do, they are probably laughing hard since they dont care anymore. i expect more ****play on the way :D