The bottom is hot

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Originally Posted by Binar

dealbreakers dont get to run into fakewars to escape punishment for dealbreaking

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nothing fake about it. Convenient yes, fake no.

Divinity got waved by us because they failed to properly close diplo after waving us. We gave them what they gave us. Emerati wants to jump in fine. They want to hit into our war, also fine. Thing is we always return favors. Don't cry when you see spartans in your news doing one of your wars next age emerati. You can justify this to yourself however you want but the bottom line is divinity did not seal an actual EOA CF with us and there is no excuse for hitting into our war. We would come after you some time any way, but now you are giving us a free pass to hit you during a hostile or war. So expect to get what you give.

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Originally Posted by jo.t.reid

1. The deal was already voided by dicks. If Emeriti wants free land, they should just call it by what it is.

2. Fake war? You kidding? Take a SN, see for yourself.

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You can spin it anyway you want, and you probably have a No AW, no massacre and no hitting T/Ms deal with them which makes this a fakewar.

As for the dealbreaking, you clearly dealbroke x2.

I would not expect those hits to stop any time soon

Depends on what deal there is between Spartans and FakeSpartans.
If its a fake war with deals about not touching T/ms and a set WD date, then I personally think its fair game for you to do as you like Anri

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Originally Posted by Binar

You can spin it anyway you want, and you probably have a No AW, no massacre and no hitting T/Ms deal with them which makes this a fakewar.

As for the dealbreaking, you clearly dealbroke x2.

I would not expect those hits to stop any time soon

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I don't expect them to stop. just giving notice that we wont forget a kd hitting into our war.

no clear dealbreak, you can argue that we did but deal 1 was never a deal because a clearly stated requirement was not met and 2 was broken after we were given written notice that they were going to wave us in a few ticks. I'm not saying we are pillars of open honesty here, but who is in UTO, we are just answering the wrongs we have been given with out overstepping the conventions of the game. Breaking a CF with a kd that mistakingly did bad diplo is nothing new or unique to spartans, nor is breaking a CF when told by a kd they are coming after you.

No agreements have been made with enemy KD. claiming their are is just another BS justification for kds to do what they like and keep up the "us good spartans bad" pretense.

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Originally Posted by Binar

Depends on what deal there is between Spartans and FakeSpartans.
If its a fake war with deals about not touching T/ms and a set WD date, then I personally think its fair game for you to do as you like Anri

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Show us the logs between Spartan and FakeSpartan leadership then. If you can't provide, I'd suggest you stop making bs accusations..?

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Originally Posted by jo.t.reid

Show us the logs between Spartan and FakeSpartan leadership then. If you can't provide, I'd suggest you stop making bs accusations..?

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Words of dealbreakers mean nothing

Spartans and fake Spartans, I think they could be saying: show us the logs between you two and how you arranged war. Yes logs can be edited but wtf, get a bit swedish and trust someone for a change if u dont.

Both kingdoms should be razed to the ground. I am actually asking pandas to keep hitting fake Spartans now. Fakewars are disgusting.

Just gotta say this to deal break or being deal-breakers that usually happens during negotiations.
The woman was actually indeed a man, this was a deal-breaker for him.

The deal was broken...
Now I believe someone is saying the deal was broken by them(dicks) first becuase the cf was not accepted at the right moment?
If this was the case the cf should have been removed from play as soon as that "deal-breaker" came into play (the deal-breaker being that for you guys the settlement was at the wrong time) it should have been withdrawn and negotiations continued.(not started again, the deal in the first place was never settled) The fact you left it in place basically saying you are still happy with the deal to continue completely shuts your argument down sorry :(

Have to ask, what is the big deal? Is it considered unsporting?

Fakewar has not been proven.

All this is bullying, which is against the spirit of the game. And this continuously happens age after age and then people wonder why the player base keeps dropping.

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Originally Posted by Binar

Words of dealbreakers mean nothing

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Damn... burnnn!

The proof will be in the pudding. Take a glance at both our kds in 3-4 irl days time. See how fake you think it is then.

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Originally Posted by jo.t.reid

Damn... burnnn!

The proof will be in the pudding. Take a glance at both our kds in 3-4 irl days time. See how fake you think it is then.

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im kinda doubting they'll be much left of them.

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Originally Posted by Kandy

Fakewar has not been proven.

All this is bullying, which is against the spirit of the game. And this continuously happens age after age and then people wonder why the player base keeps dropping.

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Its not bullying, its consequences.
Its nothing new, and its been like this since the early ages

Let's not forget some facts. Bart has previously been punished due to cheating. He's also one of the few people that manged to get permabanned from the forums. This is a player Spartans willingly takes back age after age. But I guess when someone provides free farm each time...

So people don't have a problem with Spartans they have a problem with their leadership? Yet they still want to raze kill them all to the ground, make some decent players (Spartans did win a crown last age) quit? Guess it was what I was saying the whole time. The top bans together if they feel a threat and they will break any deals or edicit they can to do it, who would stand up to them. Spartans tried look how thats going. Evident by bringing panda into this as well... Interesting. Well hope our player base doesnt get too small after the wipe out of not one but two kds. =)

Good show utopia!

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Originally Posted by Aces

So people don't have a problem with Spartans they have a problem with their leadership? Yet they still want to raze kill them all to the ground, make some decent players (Spartans did win a crown last age) quit? Guess it was what I was saying the whole time. The top bans together if they feel a threat and they will break any deals or edicit they can to do it. Evident by bringing panda into this as well... Interesting. Well hope our player base doesnt get too small after the wipe out of not one but two kds. =)

Good show utopia!

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the whole kd gets punished for the actions of its leaders. i dont want anyone to quit, i just want the leadership in Spartans to play the game correctly and honorably.

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Originally Posted by Persain

im kinda doubting they'll be much left of them.

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To quote you...

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Originally Posted by Aces

To quote you...

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Didn't your leadership realise that by breaking eowcf and then running to a fake war there would be consequences?

Stop trying to play hard done by when it's your actions that have put you in this situation

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Originally Posted by Smitty87

Didn't your leadership realise that by breaking eowcf and then running to a fake war there would be consequences?

Stop trying to play hard done by when it's your actions that have put you in this situation

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Not in spartants just an on looker who hates when I see this happen at the top... Every.... Single.... Age

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Originally Posted by Aces

Not in spartants just an on looker who hates when I see this happen at the top... Every.... Single.... Age

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I KNOW RIGHT?!? I cant believe the deal breaking and running into fake wars every age, it has to stop!

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Originally Posted by Aces

Not in spartants just an on looker who hates when I see this happen at the top... Every.... Single.... Age

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Not in Spartans?

Funny that an elf merchant in Spartans has the leader name "Aces"

Coincidence

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Originally Posted by beans

nothing fake about it. Convenient yes, fake no.

Divinity got waved by us because they failed to properly close diplo after waving us. We gave them what they gave us. Emerati wants to jump in fine. They want to hit into our war, also fine. Thing is we always return favors. Don't cry when you see spartans in your news doing one of your wars next age emerati. You can justify this to yourself however you want but the bottom line is divinity did not seal an actual EOA CF with us and there is no excuse for hitting into our war. We would come after you some time any way, but now you are giving us a free pass to hit you during a hostile or war. So expect to get what you give.

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I read the logs -- I have no angle / agenda in this and I can say it was clearly a dealbreak. Unless there is something else that I wasn't made privvy too there is no excuse for Spartans actions and they should not complain about what is happening to them now (sure there was some BS about the 7th but in my reading it seems pretty clear that was just meant for the hits, at BEST it was a gray area and in such a circumstance it is up to the kingdom that wants to act shady -- ie Spartans, to clarify AT THE TIME).

I'm not Emeriti's biggest fan but if you choose to hit into one of their wars next age with your only excuse being what is happening now don't expect the community to look the other way.

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Originally Posted by Smitty87

Not in Spartans?

Funny that an elf merchant in Spartans has the leader name "Aces"

Coincidence

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Too bad my name is acesxi in the game but thats ok. You can continue to harass me like youve been doing this whole fourm post. Its just want the top does. Noobs like me dont feel like part of the community

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Originally Posted by Aces

So people don't have a problem with Spartans they have a problem with their leadership? Yet they still want to raze kill them all to the ground, make some decent players (Spartans did win a crown last age) quit? Guess it was what I was saying the whole time. The top bans together if they feel a threat and they will break any deals or edicit they can to do it, who would stand up to them. Spartans tried look how thats going. Evident by bringing panda into this as well... Interesting. Well hope our player base doesnt get too small after the wipe out of not one but two kds. =)

Good show utopia!

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Pandas is only involved because of your war partner, doubt they have any beef with spartans other than objectively agreeing that you broke your EOA CF with divinity. Also NO-ONE wants anyone to quit the game, but if you can't see that Spartans actions are JUST as likely to lead to people quitting then I don't know what to say. The community has LONG been responsible for making sure that people keep their word in their deals. This isn't new and when you so blatantly break a deal you can expect for their to be consequences. That's a good thing.

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Originally Posted by Binar

Depends on what deal there is between Spartans and FakeSpartans.
If its a fake war with deals about not touching T/ms and a set WD date, then I personally think its fair game for you to do as you like Anri

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Agreed. I haven't seen anything that suggests it's actually a fake war though? Unless I'm missing something. It's certainly an arranged war (and very convenient for both sides) but it seems to be real enough from my snatch news. And I don't think anyone has posted anything where anyone agreed to terms like a set WD date or not touching T/Ms.

IMO Eme is justified in continuing to hit Spartans -- although I'd personally like to see divinity weigh in on what they actually want out of this -- not sure that Spartans being farmed through their war really gets them anywhere. However if it's a real war there is no reason for Pandas to keep hitting Fake Spartans (and it should be noted they HAVEN'T hit into the war yet).

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Originally Posted by TheRealKremlin

although I'd personally like to see divinity weigh in on what they actually want out of this -- not sure that Spartans being farmed through their war really gets them anywhere. However if it's a real war there is no reason for Pandas to keep hitting Fake Spartans.

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Its a fake war by the definition of how fake wars have always been(using the -75% gains to avoid a differnt conflict). Exchanging hits or semi chaining a couple of people so u dont get deleted hardly makes it a real war.

As for what my kd wants ultimately i want spartans to change how they play. If that means they have to be farmed into the war tier so they are "Easy" to handle so be it.

Pandas decided to hit into the war for a bunch of reasons. They hit us 1h prior to the war having gone to 140 meter vs us. All diplomatic attempts was answered by suck our ***** and swallow our ****. Running never really works out.

clear fw, go rape em

Nothing fake about going to war to avoid getting fed on by bigger kds. Yall just need to own your actions and stop pretending to be saints.

If a war tier/ ghetto kd gets a shady diplo deal from kd in the top then they are told "to bad, gotta learn better diplo" but when it happens in reverse we are expected to honour the intent of the deal and should have pointed out dynasties diplo failure in the beginning for them. Then with emarati we get blasted for DB because we dropped a CF after they gave written notice that they were going to break an EOA CF and wave us? the hypocrisy here is astounding and amusing.

I got no problem with yall hitting into our war, but at least be honest with yourselves about what your doing. This is a legit war between two kds that would rather war each other then sit and feed top kds. Yall aint white knights protecting the honour of UTO, just a bunch of hypocrites patting each other on the back while feeding on smaller kds.

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Originally Posted by beans

This is a legit war between two kds that would rather war each other then sit and feed top kds.

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If that were true why didn't you just NOT break eoacf with divinity and Emeriti? Wouldn't that have served your purpose alot better?

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Originally Posted by Mithras

If that were true why didn't you just NOT break eoacf with divinity and Emeriti? Wouldn't that have served your purpose alot better?

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What purpose would that be? We are a war kd and had no interest in idling the rest of the age. We didnt have an EOA CF with divinity to break and figured we would get revenge this age rather then wait till next age. Emeriti eoa cf was void bc they gave notice that they were going to raze us, so we dropped the cf. Only reason to cast sparta as deal breakers is if you dont like sparta, the facts just dont support it. Seeing how many people are saying we DB emeriti because we dropped the cf first instead of waiting for them to start hitting after they gave written notice that the deal was dead just proves that people just want to call spartans deal breakers whether or not its true.

All this BS is why I left UTO when the mega alliances took over the servers. Play time turned into BS diplo and argument time when those with power decided that they could deal how ever they wanted to but if others acted in the same way they would get burned. If dicks wants to pull in allies bc a kd they waved hit them back after their failed diplo fine. Hit into a legit war because wed rather war then get farmed by your allies, also fine. Just stop lying to yourselves about how cool and nice you are.

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Originally Posted by beans

I got no problem with yall hitting into our war, but at least be honest with yourselves about what your doing. This is a legit war between two kds that would rather war each other then sit and feed top kds. Yall aint white knights protecting the honour of UTO, just a bunch of hypocrites patting each other on the back while feeding on smaller kds.

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You havent been honest with yourself yet you demand everyone else to be honest, lol. Thats a true sign of hypocrite.

Finally found this stupid thread! I do not know why Panda is hitting in and The U is now threatening, but we are in war! The war is legit (SNATCH NEWS FOR YOURSELF)!!! This is BS and now you reminded me why I need to quit next age - been sitting on the fence...

Anri, you're still full of ****! Tell me how this is justifiable?

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Originally Posted by Korp

You havent been honest with yourself yet you demand everyone else to be honest, lol. Thats a true sign of hypocrite.

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honest about what? that letting xxx think we had an EOA CF even though they missed the deadline was a ****ty thing to do? well yeah it was. I was against the whole thing ever since they took the CF later then the deal allowed and we realized we could hit them this age. However a ****ty thing is not the same as a DB. I think my exact words were "we shouldn't sink down to their level." In no way do I think sparta is blameless, but giving some one a ****ty deal when your after revenge is not a DB and its not outside the norm for UTO even if it should be. To much damn high horsing in here for people to think clearly though.

I know a some of the white knights in here were involved with getting kds to break EOA CF deals with emirati last age for the AWAR. I also know that spartans refused to break their EOA CF with emirati.

I don't know about any of you guys, but I play this game for the fun of the wars. This age has been screwed for us from the beginning because of the bug, and if you'll note on our kd has only managed to get 2 of them, which has made this age extremely boring. Last age we finished in the top 25 of kds for WW where we won either 5 of 7 or 6 of 8 (can't really remember exactly), and we were looking forward to the same this time around.

If a kd is going to approach us with a request for war with minimal hostile time so that we can have some fun, who are we to turn that down? How dare you guys stand up on your soap box and judge us for it either? The size diff between us and the spartans is 10k acres, which is extremely different than the 50k that the Pandas have been using to pummel us over the last few days. This kind of behaviour from you top kds strutting around like you own the whole game sickens me. I enjoy this game, and haven't shied away from actually spending $$ on it either, but I'm seriously on the fence about whether or not I want to come back next age and deal with this kind of BS.

No Pandas, we're not going to give you more free land. You are out of range for us to war, so we're not going to do it. Feel free to move on when you get tired of hitting. If you keep on though, we'll keep hitting back, but we're not going to give you the button. Again, feel free to keep on whining about it in the forums. That really seems to be what you're best at.

You guys need to take a serious look at how you're approaching your attitudes to this game if you're going to kill off all activity of this game. I've only been back for a couple ages now, after a hiatus of years, and was shocked to see how small it had gotten. So, if that's what you want to happen, keep up the good work. You've really shown all of the other guys how strong and powerful you are.

Sincerely,
A disgusted and soon to be ex Utopia player

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Originally Posted by beans

honest about what? that letting xxx think we had an EOA CF even though they missed the deadline was a ****ty thing to do? well yeah it was. I was against the whole thing ever since they took the CF later then the deal allowed and we realized we could hit them this age. However a ****ty thing is not the same as a DB. I think my exact words were "we shouldn't sink down to their level." In no way do I think sparta is blameless, but giving some one a ****ty deal when your after revenge is not a DB and its not outside the norm for UTO even if it should be. To much damn high horsing in here for people to think clearly though.

I know a some of the white knights in here were involved with getting kds to break EOA CF deals with emirati last age for the AWAR. I also know that spartans refused to break their EOA CF with emirati.

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Like trying to deny that the terms you tried to set with Divinity was a clear fake war. Or like the fact that Spartans harbor that piece of **** Bart. Or how Bart has countless times ****played in all possible ways. Karma is a *****, you reap what you sow etc. :)

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Originally Posted by Korp

Like trying to deny that the terms you tried to set with Divinity was a clear fake war. Or like the fact that Spartans harbor that piece of **** Bart. Or how Bart has countless times ****played in all possible ways. Karma is a *****, you reap what you sow etc. :)

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haha yeah I was actually telling Bart in KD chat that I agree with the bart's an asshole part of this thread. So now its time to hit into the wars of all the kds who have asshole monarchs, good to know!

Sweden, look to glorious sweden... a king that was on the people side, not the lordship, the top. People are simply people, lords and dukes are simple men, too. Men will always be biased for their own self-interest. It is very difficult to get a functioning community where you mix that self-interest with social responsibilities. Nobody is doing anything consciously, but the lords, "tops", is bound to be corrupting themself, ever so slightly.

I truly think this private CF business it detrimental. Perhaps some kind of "bill of rights", that people playing this game would have to accept, should be implmented after all. Cause lets face it, ppl just aint swedish enuff to be able to trust their fellow man without falling prey for their own selfishness. Next problem: who will implement and decide when this big general contract, amendments, has been broken...

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Originally Posted by Persain

Its a fake war by the definition of how fake wars have always been(using the -75% gains to avoid a differnt conflict). Exchanging hits or semi chaining a couple of people so u dont get deleted hardly makes it a real war.

As for what my kd wants ultimately i want spartans to change how they play. If that means they have to be farmed into the war tier so they are "Easy" to handle so be it.

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That isn't my definition for a fake war :) If Pandas are justified in hitting in is another question. Certainly xxx is running from them and they WHERE hitting Pandas back. NONE of that means their war is fake though and using a war to avoid another conflict has nothing to do with said war being fake. Also it happens all the time, usually just less blatantly than here.

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Originally Posted by beans

Nothing fake about going to war to avoid getting fed on by bigger kds. Yall just need to own your actions and stop pretending to be saints.

If a war tier/ ghetto kd gets a shady diplo deal from kd in the top then they are told "to bad, gotta learn better diplo" but when it happens in reverse we are expected to honour the intent of the deal and should have pointed out dynasties diplo failure in the beginning for them. Then with emarati we get blasted for DB because we dropped a CF after they gave written notice that they were going to break an EOA CF and wave us? the hypocrisy here is astounding and amusing.

I got no problem with yall hitting into our war, but at least be honest with yourselves about what your doing. This is a legit war between two kds that would rather war each other then sit and feed top kds. Yall aint white knights protecting the honour of UTO, just a bunch of hypocrites patting each other on the back while feeding on smaller kds.

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Protesting a bit much there.... Like I said,I've read the logs and IMO you straight up deal broke. No "clever diplo", just broke your word. From my reading of it the 7th "deadline" reads more as hits stopping by then. Sure it's gray but that's generally how Utopia has worked and if you wanted to be clever you needed to spell it out that if the CF wasn't accepted on the 7th then there was NO deal at all and it was just a blank CF. You didn't do that (or whoever was in charge of diplo for Spartans didn't do that).