Science is fundamentally unbalanced and unbalancing.

[Bishop]

A cap might be ok, but purchasing won't happen. There is already too much incentive to sit in fw, not going to allow people to farm sci in it also.

[Kayani]

My problem with the current science system is that it encourages sitting around and pumping for weeks on end, which is boring. Anything we can do to get rid of a 2-week boredom pump is a good thing :) On the other hand, if you make it too easy to get, everyone will have it, and it will be pointless. So ... I dunno. I can't say how to fix it, but removing science sounds bad, and the current boredom pump system is bad too.

Edit: I don't agree with the poster who says it is unbalancing though. It *is* a tradeoff in it's current state. What I think might help is to discourage the higher rates (3 BPA / hour "Extreme", etc.) and encourage more of a longer-term commitment to incorporating it into your economy. Maybe have a bonus on science the longer you keep it on a certain setting? Kind of the way OME goes up really slowly if you set your wage to 200%? That way, it encourages someone to set it to "Active" or whatever and leave it there - thus making Science a long-term commitment (which is what I think the devs wanted) and also discouraging pumps (because maybe 2+ weeks on Active give you the same benefit of the first hour of "Extreme"). I dunno - just a thought off the top of my head.

[Elurin]

We're also heading into our 7th war and all the good players in kd have great sciences with but a single sci pump in all age (1.5 weeks of pure sci). Sure, if you want 2k bpa or more you need serious pumping, but 1k+ is good enough to compete vs most kd's.

Out of the original points I agree with sages and schools being flawed. Having all bonuses on such an important thing as science on a single personality provides an unbalanced gameplay. Furthermore, having the same building protect science as procudes it is no good, makes provinces pumping immune to outside learns.

[kalandra]

I am wondering, would the "damage" be lessen if science was easier gotten through conflict/interaction with other players rather passive pumping 24/7.

Several things I can think off

- Add an op/spell that can steal science books in normal relation.
- Improve the learn attack so you can get better gains from a low NW/Acre province thats trying to science pump.
- Reduce sage and school protection of science that can be stolen and "learn"-ed
- Reduce the -science cost% for sage and add + steal science book gains & + learn attacks gains to nudge to get science from other province instead of passive pumping.

[silent_killer]

A cap might be ok, but purchasing won't happen. There is already too much incentive to sit in fw, not going to allow people to farm sci in it also.

purchasing science in a fw or war the cost was higher i Just don't recall the exact figures.
I don't get your logic bishop that will allow people to farm science in it also, what exactly do you mean?

[silent_killer]

I am wondering, would the "damage" be lessen if science was easier gotten through conflict/interaction with other players rather passive pumping 24/7.

sorry what's gotten?

by the way, there is no such thing as passive pumping, although the current process science is acquired passively

Add an op/spell that can steal science books in normal relation.

add an op/spell that can steal science books in normal ? really this is is your idea, there really is no thought process to this idea, quite abusable.

Improve the learn attack so you can get better gains from a low NW/Acre province thats trying to science pump.

why would you improve gains on a bottom feed, secondly if they are in a science pump it would mean their science is minimal how can you acquire more?

i'm not even gonna address the other 2 statement you made cuz it really adds very little logic to it. you've already contradicted yourself several times

[Bishop]

purchasing science in a fw or war the cost was higher i Just don't recall the exact figures.
I don't get your logic bishop that will allow people to farm science in it also, what exactly do you mean?

who purchases sci in the fw? you stock millions and dump it into sci after war ends.

[Korp]

who purchases sci in the fw? you stock millions and dump it into sci after war ends.

Its not much different now either, now you just stack up with gold and run extreme science after war ended.

[Bishop]

and risk being plundered or thieved - so its kinda ok. If you can dump all cash into sci straight away you avoid that issue.

[kalandra]

sorry what's gotten?

by the way, there is no such thing as passive pumping, although the current process science is acquired passively


add an op/spell that can steal science books in normal ? really this is is your idea, there really is no thought process to this idea, quite abusable.


why would you improve gains on a bottom feed, secondly if they are in a science pump it would mean their science is minimal how can you acquire more?

i'm not even gonna address the other 2 statement you made cuz it really adds very little logic to it. you've already contradicted yourself several times

English isn't my first language.

Ignore my bottomfeed learn suggestion then. But would you consider a science stealing op in hostile/war relation only?

[silent_killer]

who purchases sci in the fw? you stock millions and dump it into sci after war ends.

how would that be any different with the current process? jump into a fake war rotate buildings run active without increase in cost and saved gold then run extreme afterwards?
secondly there really is no need to save and purchase if the science is purchasable, the current process of building conversion to have the necessary income to run extreme is a longer tedious process

[silent_killer]

English isn't my first language.

Ignore my bottomfeed learn suggestion then. But would you consider a science stealing op in hostile/war relation only?

there is an amnesia spell already and acquiring science through spell is unnecessary

[kalandra]

there is an amnesia spell already and acquiring science through spell is unnecessary

Notice I didn't wrote spell. I realized that and figure it would fit best as an thievery op.

[silent_killer]

and risk being plundered or thieved - so its kinda ok. If you can dump all cash into sci straight away you avoid that issue.

this is a losing situation for you bishop, you can also get plundered and thief while in a fake war and secondly when war does end it doesn't mean all 25 individuals would be able to log in and purchase science at the very instant

[Korp]

and risk being plundered or thieved - so its kinda ok. If you can dump all cash into sci straight away you avoid that issue.

You can also plunder into fw, even thou the gains bit worse, its still quite nice gain. Besides, you only need to secure most threats with cfs and naps and you are pretty much safe from most, one random there and here is acceptable loss.