Evil Dragons...

[divine]

anti-fun
*So you are saying you had the right to trash talk cause you felt you were stronger and in a position of power? And you call us bullies?
*Yes both sides are responsible for the war forums turning ugly after the war. That was clear from what i said too.
*So you got called out. That got nothing to do with trash talk though
*I dont see how that is related to anything sorry.
*Dates checked and confirmed to be in line with my original statement
*Clearly some other people from strippers disagreed with you
*You had four days of eowcf. also it is 25vs24 according to kingdom page right now. Dont know where you got your information.
*That has been answered many times already. We razekilled one province after the kingdom agreed to war us but then land dropped and used size difference as excuse to break the agreement of war. Plenty of other kingdom have rejected us and havent gotten any razes. I think by now you understand that we are after you cause we are tired of the trash talking and double standards strippers put forth. We want to fight you and this is the only option left.

Now Anti-fun please start to read what are being said to you as i assume that most people are tired of your unability to understand what anyone is saying.

[anti-fun]

Not sure if you ever notice our kd page,one of the stripper province got pked and just got out of protection so why isnt it a 23v25?

And it already said many many times before strippers did NOT reject your war we would be warring and you guys would have your revenge ,whats 4 days since you guys were waiting for 6 weeks plus for us? With a better setup, a bank and 23v 25 you guys are favourites to win strippers even if we pump 4 days anyway.

So pls get your information right before starting to citricise other people thank you.

[Yadda9To5]

I?d compare strippers tactics to bad Nigerian scam. Pretty sure strippers has 24 provs to say, oh please give us pretty button we?re at a severe disadvantage so giving us the shiny will make war all pretty and fair. Seeing their war record, nub kingdoms even fall for that. One might argue all?s fair to get your wins, but if it is, then so are ED?s actions. I dislike utopia politics with a passion, but this is pure karma coming back at strippers.

[KennyPowers]

7.) We surrender after 72 hours like agreed and someone from our side makes a war tips thread on the forums and offers tips on warring which i believe included the reasons we lost and what we should have done different.
8.) Your KDs immediate response was to flame him and say we suck.

I will add that EDs very first "war tips" post said "f you don't act you're good". For myself and others(can't speak for all) this is what started the flaming. I don't really care regardless but I felt you were leaving an important part out. Eventually ED will get bored or find another war and we'll move on

[Ezzerland]

Eventually ED will get bored or find another war and we'll move on

And when someone else takes over?

You see, a problem for strippers here is the concept that you think it's ok to rob into other kingdoms wars. I really don't know/care about your past situations with ED or any of this situation, but since you're here I'll make a comment now. You don't want to be mistreated, watch what you do.

[Forensick]

Strippers seem to keep saying they only war KDs that are bigger than them

Average Opponent Relative Size 98% <---- strippers

-fairly sure that means unlike what you keep saying/implying you ARE NOT warring up, you war targets aren't "mostly 300k bigger".
wanna know what "warring up" looks like?
.
.
Average Opponent Relative Size 110% <----- Evil Dragons
we have made it perfectly clear we will war anything, last KD we warred was almost 1mil n/w bigger than us, and war lasted 8 days.

only KD we have declined a war to (when being waved, not messaged) we told we were waiting for you -i believe they know you and were fine waiting in that case- we also told them we would be happy to war them later.
we didnt set dates, we completely expect that next time they are looking, and we are in range they will wave us (omg without messaging first!) and we will respond with war. given our dealings with that KD, i look forward to a nice friendly war, hopefully brutal, war.

but as for the people saying "ED are the reason this game is failing" i started playing in late 2000.
this game has been running for almost 15 years. a text based, browser based, MATH game, in the age of WoW CoD and CS, being played for that long, (and most of that time with people having the same attitude as ED does now), if the game shut down tomorrow it still makes it one of the most successful games of all time.... -hardly "failing"

also its worth noting that this is a WAR game. it says so to the left every time you login.
the thing about wars is, people tend not to ask for them in advance, one side is always the aggressor.
did iraq have a chat to the US to organise a convenient invasion date, so they could get ready?
and if iraq didnt fight back, would america have left?

and where it isn't a war game, it is a competition measured in charts.
Strippers are higher than ED on honour charts. The most efficent way to over take them, is to war them and take their honour.
if war wont come, or takes to long, the next best option is to make them lose honour, and make it harder for them to win wars in the future, or have to spend a few weeks not warring to rebuild wpas. Giving us a chance to catch up in wars and honour

Strippers seem to be adopting the french wwii strategy, get completely destroyed without fighting back, and hope someone will come to the rescue.
Only no one will it seems

[flutterby]

Strippers seem to be adopting the french strategy, get completely destroyed without fighting back, and hope someone will come to the rescue.

That actually made me LOL.

[Zauper]

Eventually ED will get bored or find another war and we'll move on

Or your kingdom will disband. Probably long before we get bored. Why, you wonder? It's simple -- we're having a good time.

We've already gotten PMs from a few of your players that are thinking about leaving.

So sad.

So, if ED been waiting for 6 weeks whats another 4 days? Then you would get the war.

That's true and false. There's no reason for us to wait longer for them to wind up not even warring us. You'll notice that none of their statements were even definitive. "We would entertain a rematch" doesn't mean they'd war us. Beyond that, considering that we don't trust them, there's no reason for us to enter into a deal with them. We're not dissatisfied with the current state of things.

Seems like you guys wanna police the whole community into whats right or wrong,if you guys feel that you guys wont win you can just reject the war and we can just move on last age,the difference this age is that we did not have an agreement on war this age.99% of the kingdoms we met or being waved we just take the wave and move on in our own ways.Seems like you guys wanna start a new meta on razing provinces who do not agree to war as explicitly shown in your messages and interesting conditions.

Hello again Mr. Anti-fun. When you are dealing with a kingdom that is after honor or a war, you are correct -- telling them you won't war will often cause them to go away because that is their interest. Our interest is revenge and a grudge fight. If you want to war us as part of that, great, we can wash out most of the grudge. If not, we're happy to kill your provinces. It doesn't bug us at all. There is nothing in the community that would fundamentally go against what we're doing. We're pretty upfront about how we handle diplomacy.

I am, however, glad that you enjoyed my conditions. I note that your monarch chose to ignore them.

Where is this information coming from about us land dropping to avoid you? We have had 5 wars back to back and have mostly challenged larger kds who we have had to explore in war to catch up to. Only on one occasion did we have a friendly kd take acres from an oversized attacker of ours who was 200% the size of our core, losing 300 or so acres on our biggest prov is hardly justification to the claim that we were land dropping to avoid you.

Hi Silly. You're correct, JONCY was overstating it as 'land dropping to avoid us'. We do know that you land dropped (as you admit). You try to offer a justification, but all land dropping is land dropping and it is all incredibly lame and worthy of a raze kill by itself. If you don't want the land, don't take it in the first place.

Why did you ignore my conditions? So sad.

If this is the standard of behavior in Utopia, it's no wonder this game is not succeeding.

Indeed, the pussy behavior displayed by strippers after acting all big earlier in this thread is quite embarrassing and is part of why utopia is less ethical now than ever.

We do not regard their plundering as dirty. We stole from them, they can steal from us. It wasnt until after their plunders that I asked for a few days. Like Korp said, if they waited 6 weeks to war us why not just wait a few more days? Sure, you don't owe us that time. We just thought you would have preferred a war with us instead of whatever it is we are doing now

We're happy either way. Understand, though -- we won't stop hitting until you disband or war us.

I guess you could take my other condition as well, if you want to apologize publicly. I'd be happy to help you write your apology as well.

Took a couple mins to look at both ur kingdoms and I laughed my ass off...with all the talk about taking on bigger kingdoms I thought dragons would be smaller than strippers....but no they are much much larger plus they have more provinces...I thought you guys were cool for a second but I was wrong

You are trying to force a war with a kingdom that's barely in ur range because they beat you last age...rest assured no kingdom will war you if this is how you respond to a loss ..

So you've already raze kiled a kingdom...and now you plan on raze killin stripper provs also...so its not just strrippers you are dirty to its the entire server...

And good game strippers for not letting them bait you into a war with those tactics.

And id say their actions make it clear they are afraid to face strippers on equal footing just courious what was the nw difference when the attacks started??

Hello utopiannoob, a strippers player. The NW difference was about 400k when the attacks started. We're not afraid to face them on equal footing. They're welcome to pull themselves up to equal footing while we hit them.

We offered them a perfectly reasonable 5 hour CF followed by war. Not our fault if they were afraid to take it. Beyond that, ~1500 acres isn't exactly 'much larger', particularly considering that we're only larger because they've given us what 3-4 free waves of hits?

Barely in our range? We've warred two kds 20% larger than us this age. We're less than 10% larger than them in NW, and maybe 5% larger in land. We are solidly in eachothers war range.

Korp, only difference (not taking sides here) that I can see between plundering into EoW CF and stealing gold is plundering does more damage because you lose troops too. A bit more nasty given that you simultaneously kill both resources needed to recover from that. but a lot would depend on execution I guess.... but I believe that losses are unaffected by the gains penalty right? so its kind of a more effective bounce wave.

Sheister, the kills aren't that high hitting oow. I want to say kills were identical for both kds, and we're running hospitals while they aren't. And they were all home while we weren't. Beyond that, last age they stole a huge chunk of money from the cow that was going to pay to heavily pump a number of provinces, including a second one we had explored up -- ultimately, that's probably more effective than a few random plunders. Especially when they were EOWCF stealing from another kd in EOWCF.

Just disappointing to me because was really looking forward to the war.

Then war us. We're not preventing you from warring us, you're preventing yourselves. Beyond that, your new tactic of 'let's do nothing back and rely on utopia to try to police them!' is clearly not working -- everyone who is publicly aligned with a kingdom other than one of ours has supported us in this thread, not you. The only folks posting in support of your kingdom are your players, and a few folks that have >10 posts and hadn't posted in 2+ years -- probably your players as well.

Utopiannoob: a roro is a Romanian. They think you're one because your English is terrible and nonsensical. Most roros that have played utopia over the years have also lacked ethics, which wouldn't be surprising considering your kingdom.

There hasn't been a single kd that has waved us this age that we have not warred.

Us. We waved you and you haven't warred us.

Though we also havent been OOW for very long as we were arranging wars while in postwar cf. We intended to war you guys, what don't you get?

Then war us.

All I asked for was 96 hours, you guys would have still had the upper hand even after that time.

You're not getting 96 hours. You don't need 8 days to prepare for a war.
Flutterby also summed it up pretty well for me:

Just because you asked for a few more days does not mean you get a few more days. That is the problem with this game anymore, everyone seems to think that it is all about notices and agreements.

As a reminder, we called you out 20 days ago. What were you doing in that intervening time while we were tagged?

As another reminder, you said this then --

it's likely their[ED's] strategy is still just as poor. What excuses will they drop next time we beat them? Stay tuned

If we're so bad, why are you so afraid?

I said very clearly that if you waved out the gate we would not war.

Then we'll kill. We're ok with that.

I'm sure there are some players in your kd who are wishing you guys just held off and we could have warred and maybe you would have won and we would admit you are the better kd fair and square.

We're ok with this.

Instead you've taken this route and we havent done a single op or attack and you continue razing us believing you are in the right. There is no right or wrong any more, the community will judge the actions of both kds and form their own opinions. Will this thread get you to back off? Probably not. We are just reporting in on the facts.

The community will judge us? You have been measured, you have been weighed. And you have been found wanting. Did you know that I have gotten a PM on these forums from other folks pissed off with your lack of ethics that want to go after you as well? There are no new 'facts' for you to report. There is a conflict between our kingdoms, you're pussying out.

What, do you think the community will rise up and make us stop? You are the one in the wrong. We haven't done anything wrong. You picked a fight, we're ending it. Deal with it. War us if you want it to end sooner rather than later.

Not 3 weeks ago you, the monarch of strippers and some of your kdmates were in this very thread saying that we're not a good kingdom. What's the matter? You can't beat us even though we're so bad? What does that say about you?

Those are the facts.

You left out the part where both kds agreed to war last age, and this age we asked for a few more days of down-time before war, a message that was simply ignored.

You left out the part where after we agreed to war last age you robbed over 15M from us and we didn't pussy out. There is no god given right to have more time to prepare or be equally prepared for a war. Tell you what -- you can have 96 hours to prepare for war. We just won't stop hitting you.

their play style is to repay not just walk away because its not worth their time

This is more or less correct. We have nothing to play for, so we play for fun. We don't care about end of age results, we play to get even and we play for keeps.

The exchange between anti-fun and divine is more or less incomprehensible because it's not clear who's quoting what when. I did enjoy anti-fun signing his post divine, though.

As a reminder, here were my perfectly reasonable counteroffers you ignored:
1) 5 hour CF followed by war. This must be accepted in the next 73 minutes.
2) We razekill 5 of your provinces, then all 24 members of your kingdom post here publicly acknowledging that we are the better kingdom and apologizing for their rude and hurtful words.
3) Your kingdom disbands.

You'll note that you no longer qualify for the first one. I suppose I can extend you a 3 hour CF offer.

It also amuses me that for your last war, you declared on a kingdom the hour after they offered you a CF. I guess a CF offer doesn't always end hostilities in your mind, does it?

At the end of the day it comes down to this - you want to play in a utopia where you can safely bait weaker kingdoms than you into war and try to eliminate risk and fun from the game. You want to play a one-sided game where you always take advantage of other kingdom and they can never get on an even footing. We play a game of risks and fun. We war kingdoms we shouldn't beat, and we usually win. Sometimes we lose. We have grudges and we win those too. No one is forcing you to play our way, but there are consequences to your actions and we'll make you pay them. Even if the people you did it to in the past didn't.

All of your excuses just prove one thing: We're the better kingdom. It proves that my post in the war forum last age was correct. You aren't good. Between the 24 of you, you don't have a single pair of balls.

[Forensick]

TI'm sure there are some players in your kd who are wishing you guys just held off and we could have warred and maybe you would have won and we would admit you are the better kd fair and square

actually, i think divine is our most peaceful player, so if he is fully on board, that is really all of us.
... and we are a different generation of players. Waving is the war request, say no, or accept your losses till the aggressor is done.
and with about 4 other KDs in our war range up or down, even if we weren't all 100% okay with this "hostile", we wouldnt have anything else to do until one of those KDs became available... seeing as unlike other "top warring KDs" we do not land drop, not a single acre, not ever

[Persain]

actually, i think divine is our most peaceful player, so if he is fully on board, that is really all of us.
... and we are a different generation of players. Waving is the war request, say no, or accept your losses till the aggressor is done.

I'd just like to point out that the current courtesy that most war kds give each other is to stop hitting when a war is turned down. Because war/fun all that gets valued by both kds so theres no reason to waste time retal waring.

However...i dont think that applies here,

When you are dealing with a kingdom that is after honor or a war, you are correct -- telling them you won't war will often cause them to go away because that is their interest. Our interest is revenge and a grudge fight. If you want to war us as part of that, great, we can wash out most of the grudge. If not, we're happy to kill your provinces. It doesn't bug us at all. There is nothing in the community that would fundamentally go against what we're doing. We're pretty upfront about how we handle diplomacy.

I think u'll find most kds will respect a grudge match especially when both sides have a reputation.

[MrCurious]

Strippers robbed 10mil gc into our eowcf this age. They deserve the beating. Karma is a *****

[Binar]

*opens a beer and takes a seat*

Didnt take long before Zauper and the ED crew were back having fun :)

Strippers: Less QQ, more Pew Pew! Just war them, ED isnt going anywhere :P

[tetley]

Strippers robbed 10mil gc into our eowcf this age. They deserve the beating. Karma is a *****

Served!!

Also lol this thread is 10 pages...

[Forensick]

Served!!

Also lol this thread is 10 pages...

of course it is, we are kinda awesome

[silverfox]

Well this was quite an epic backfire.

Strippers want the utopia world to know how mean, bullying and unfair Evil Dragons are while all that seems to have happened are more KDs coming forward and saying how Strippers have stolen from them in EoWCF or acted like "cocky jerks" towards them and wished us luck/want to have their pound of flesh once we're done.

Classic.