AMA vs sanct round 2

[Lykron]

You think its was funny for us to get robed and cant prepare for havoc and war them proper? Havoc spend 6 weeks to pump for this war. We had post war+48h notice for prepare. Do you think interfere from sanctuary don't hurt us much? Its lame what did Sanctuary. They loss his war. Was time for move on and ask for cf us. Don't blame AMA when its all Sanctuary fault to interfere.


You mean i'm going to be popular and famous :P

so now you've stopped claiming that havoc notice was a dealbreak ?

[Nick_mi]

If everyone knew that, AMA should have pursued a CF with a Sanc. If it was a non-Abs kd this wouldn't be an issue, thus the double standard. It was undefended gc taken by a non-CFed kd and it was not into any type of hostile. There is nothing to even talk about here. AMA made a mistake and put themselves in a bad spot.

What he said

Do you think get notice from havoc mean we cant wave Sanctuary? They robed from us 100 mill. There is no way to let them get it for free.

This just in, new kingdom strat. Don't run thieves just run an automatic retal policy on anyone that robs from you, and then ***** that they robbed you, not that you forgot to train a key element to your province and expect it not to get taken.

You think its was funny for us to get robed and cant prepare for havoc and war them proper?

Should read, You think it was funny for us to forget to train thieves or cf the only kd who can rob me in eowcf and cant prepare for havoc war them proper?

[Elit]

so now you've stopped claiming that havoc notice was a dealbreak ?

If we prefer to be naive havoc don't had any idea Sanctuary robed us so they send his notice proper. I send them msg instant but they refuse to drop notice. If some one need to be blamed its Sanctuary main. We expected and was preparing for incoming notice and war them.

About comments for 0 thieves prov. I told it already but maybe you missed it. Its was result from our cow had accident and didn't log for long to train at all. He was on 50 PR not trained and with 0 thieves. You cant compare his 0 thives with havoc because we was in post war and he was supposed to have it for limited time. Its proper way for play it. What did havoc was to sit with 0 thives in stance normal for weeks. Its very risk. We didn't made it.

[Nick_mi]

About comments for 0 thieves prov. I told it already but maybe you missed it. Its was result from our cow had accident and didn't log for long to train at all. He was on 50 PR not trained and with 0 thieves. You cant compare his 0 thives with havoc because we was in post war and he was supposed to have it for limited time. Its proper way for play it. What did havoc was to sit with 0 thives in stance normal for weeks. Its very risk. We didn't made it.

Your mistake: 1: Forgetting to train thieves 2: Not attempting to cf sanc
Your punishiment(imo): Loss of gold.
Your punishment(elits opinion): Nothing? No punishment for making a mistake and forgetting something? How do I get this luxary and where do I need to sign?

It's not abs job to go out of our way to secure your 1v1s. If you had attempted to CF sanc and they just ignored it, then came oowcf and ****ed with you, I could see you getting angry. But you made a mistake, you got punished for it, and now you're trying to leverage our alliance against us. As Dharan said, if this was pulse and not sanc, this would not be an issue, but since the two kds are allied, you will push your agenda to try and fix your mistake. Some people will buy it I guess.

[utopiatina1974]

When things happen, u need to be cool and calm. AMA should of offered CF. It might be useless cause the ops, etc were probably planned. But why not offer CF anyway? If they refuse it, then u can criticize on their tactics. But AMA didn't. So Sanc and friends continue. Why do u assume so much, it puts u in a tough spot. Instead of raging, you should of done the wise thing, even if it probably won't help, but now your opponents can say ... "aha! you didn't offer CF, so we continue" .... DUH?!

[Bishop]

AMA should have waved Sanc.

[Elit]

Your mistake: 1: Not attempting to cf sanc 2: Forgetting to train thieves
Your punishiment(imo): Loss of gold.
Your punishment(elits opinion): Nothing? No punishment for making a mistake and forgetting something? How do I get this luxary and where do I need to sign?

You cant put in your utopia plans something unexpected in rl going to happen. When its happen you deal with it. No one asked Sanctuary to rob us. They decide it, we decide to punish them and wave, they decide to retal not give free wave. Now we are in clear hostile again. There is zero attempts from Sanctuary to solve it with diplo so i assume they plan to war us. We plan same.
No need any more talk.

[guard14n]

Lykron

1. How many people played 6 years ago, 5 years ago, 2 years ago, 1 year ago and today. Do the reasearch, get the results and u will see that the game is dying. And one of the reasons (ONE not all the) is that official ally kds like abs always do what they like. Remember the time when Mehul was running the game ? What was the point of the game - random people meet and cooperate to make something strong. Ergo u cant play with ur friends like it is now. What was abs back then - exactly what they are now. They traded accs, cheated and bullied everyone who doesnt agree with them. Its not that my logic is flawed its that u lack info or just dont wanna agree via motives of defending abs in this current situation.

2. The game is ment to be played by cooperating with people and win in certain areas vs other people. It is fair as long as its 1vs1 kd. It doesnt matter if the kd is 5 people or 25 but as long as its one. I hold my own in 2vs25 (provinces) but there was no help from any other kd. The is the only thing that never change in this game. The reason i stated 100v25 is the real possibility that to happen. There are a certain number of abs kds all with 25 players. Its possible for all of them to bash the same kd (u've seen it with simians and 3 abs kds). This is the problem with this alliance !

3. Its ok to have friends in the top but its not ok to play dirty and gang people like abs do. Its like lets say Havoc invades Elit honorably (excluding the Sanc hostile drama) and elit asks every kd in top 25 that does not like ABS (there are quitte a lot of them as u know) to start waving havoc before elit declares. This is NOT what friends are used of. ABS is kinda doing that right now - "I dont think i can win vs them so lets get our friends to rob them minutes after they go out of war (with the same allies) and a few min later we will notice them! It will look like there is a coincidence and we may look innocent. This will give us the chance to 2v1 them". Sounds legit for me. Also why did Sanc started taking intel on AMA RIGHT AFTER the war with that same kd ended ? U dont take intel from someone unless u want to either steal, attack or prepare for a wave. Considering during the eowcf they cant get intel and the WIERD timing of the stealing + notice i dont buy that its just chance.

4. What racism about this ? Gypsies are a cultural group that is all rnd the world and they are mostly emigrants. Their ethnos varries from Indian,Irish, French, Spanish, Russian etc. Altho they share a few habbits as an overall comunity. 1st they are nomads by default (not all of them but most of them) and second they are always ganging up when trouble comes. This example is not racist cuz it shows that they are united and stick together but this is in real life. In game the same example was used by me to show that abs can solve their problems alone and use help (in their case its ok but here we play a game of honor, politics and role playing middle ages fantasy wars in a world of "noble" and "honorable" kds where that kind of behavior is considered weak, dishonorable, cowerdly and overall - bad.

Its easy to resolve the whole situation as i said before. Let AMA solve their problems with sanc. During that time Havoc can pump more and explore and pump and explore. This hostile will drain AMA a bit or at least wont let them be as strong as they could be and havoc on the other side will be even stronger. Not exploiting the situation like this (using strategy and getting advantage while still acting honorably) is stupid. Exploiting this situation with ordering a 2v1 hostile and using ur buddies to smack the top kd is just playing petty and as i said before - gypsy like behaivior dat in this virtual world is despicable !

[Palem]

The game's dying? News to me. Been pretty stable for a long time now. If the game IS dying, it's not because of Abs.

No one asked Sanctuary to rob us. They decide it, we decide to punish them and wave, they decide to retal not give free wave. Now we are in clear hostile again. There is zero attempts from Sanctuary to solve it with diplo so i assume they plan to war us. We plan same.
No need any more talk.

The problem is you're punishing yourselves. You don't seem to realize this though...

[DHaran]

You know very well abs leaders idle in 1 channel. Do you think when sanctuary start rob us havoc didn't know it instant. Do you think get notice from havoc mean we cant wave Sanctuary? They robed from us 100 mill. There is no way to let them get it for free. Its was Sanctuary mistake to rob us if they cant war us. Now both kds are in hostile and Havoc need so hold till its end or double hostile. Both options is not best for havoc and its all result from Sanctuary acted stupid.

So what? If SPGC robbed you of 100m do you think Havoc wouldn't know that too? They'd notice you anyway, cuz your terms allowed them to. Yes you are now hostile with Sanc and Havoc will have to wait to avoid a double. However, the notice was legitimate and they can wave you immediately following your hostile with Sanc. I still fail to see what the discussion is about lol.

[jamin]

So what? If SPGC robbed you of 100m do you think Havoc wouldn't know that too? They'd notice you anyway, cuz your terms allowed them to. Yes you are now hostile with Sanc and Havoc will have to wait to avoid a double. However, the notice was legitimate and they can wave you immediately following your hostile with Sanc. I still fail to see what the discussion is about lol.

the voice of reason, is it really that hard for some people to figure it out?

[Anri]

Same old people taking abs side when its dead clear to most what is going on.

[goodz]

Same old people taking abs side when its dead clear to most what is going on.

I would argue that most have no idea.

Its random people who make aabs threads and have like 30 posts and likely play in ghettos who get bottomfed who are complaining primarily.

People have their opinions and acting one way or another won't change them.

[Persain]

So what? If SPGC robbed you of 100m do you think Havoc wouldn't know that too? They'd notice you anyway, cuz your terms allowed them to. Yes you are now hostile with Sanc and Havoc will have to wait to avoid a double. However, the notice was legitimate and they can wave you immediately following your hostile with Sanc. I still fail to see what the discussion is about lol.

Whats "fair" and technically allowed isnt what should always be done. ABS/HoH plays as 4 kds in an alliance, either they agree to 1v1v1v1....or they play blocking/weakening & collusion to ensure one of their teams wins. To that end every action taken by a kd speaks towards the alliance as a whole. The ideals that people like ASF and Jdorje talk about when speaking of ABS are that the alliance exists to solve big problems issues like gbing one of your kd mates and promote fair play, not to power play and force an alliance victory. "Fair play" an having morals/set standards of an alliance should mean that you effectively handicap yourself such that you dont get to do things like steal 100m gold from a kd pumping to war your alliance member or notice someone whose dealing with a member of your alliance.

I would argue that most have no idea.
Its random people who make aabs threads and have like 30 posts and likely play in ghettos who get bottomfed who are complaining primarily.
People have their opinions and acting one way or another won't change them.

Eh you got screwed either way, its not a loud enough move to the “community” if you simply reinstated the 48 hour notice. The people u could sway don’t have enough power to make any real impact. As much as I like to call you a coward over that one war Goodz you’re a reasonable leader in a bad situation, If I were you I’d be angry at Jdorje right about now.

[DHaran]

Same old people taking abs side when its dead clear to most what is going on.

The fact that it's Abs is entirely irrelevant, you guys just want to introduce a double standard against them for something that would be entirely ok for any other two kingdoms. If Simians robbed Sanc of 100m gc then AMA noticed them, you guys would make the exact same comments I'm making, so stop with the hypocrisy lol.

Whats "fair" and technically allowed isnt what should always be done. ABS/HoH plays as 4 kds in an alliance, either they agree to 1v1v1v1....or they play blocking/weakening & collusion to ensure one of their teams wins. To that end every action taken by a kd speaks towards the alliance as a whole. The ideals that people like ASF and Jdorje talk about when speaking of ABS are that the alliance exists to solve big problems issues like gbing one of your kd mates and promote fair play, not to power play and force an alliance victory. "Fair play" an having morals/set standards of an alliance should mean that you effectively handicap yourself such that you dont get to do things like steal 100m gold from a kd pumping to war your alliance member or notice someone whose dealing with a member of your alliance.


Eh you got screwed either way, its not a loud enough move to the “community” if you simply reinstated the 48 hour notice. The people u could sway don’t have enough power to make any real impact. As much as I like to call you a coward over that one war Goodz you’re a reasonable leader in a bad situation, If I were you I’d be angry at Jdorje right about now.

AMA knew Havoc could give notice, AMA didn't get a CF with Sanc, AMA had undefended gc. Why would it be acceptable for every other kingdom on the server except Abs to steal that gc? That's the dumbest logic possible. AMA didn't get screwed, they screwed up, there's a difference. Why would goodz be angry with jdorje? AMA waved Sanc, that has nothing to do with Havoc. This whole conversation is just ridiculous, mostly by people with no basic reasoning ability.