Evil Dragons...

[Korp]

That WW's matter; you get to farm ghettos, in-turn giving you land and honour. Also shows which KDs have the balls, will-power, and activity to jump into many wars over the course of 3 months. Wars are actually the ONLY thing that makes Utopia worthwhile, so, why would you not want a WW chart?

Cause the warwin chart as it is now is totally crap.

[Sig]

Typical constructive post, keep up the good work.

[Utopiannoob1]

agree with sig warring is what makes this game fun...to play for land/nw equals an entire age of dicing/exploring and making naps with other large kingdoms that is totally boring if you ask me...however the WW chart could be tweaked a bit i liked the idea that was mentioned somewhere about getting a bonus/penalty on your record that is determined by how well your opponents do throughout the age ie for every war your opponent wins gets you an extra 10% of a win and every loss they suffer gets you -10%

so if you war a kingdom that was exact same size and win...at end of age they are 4/5 war record then instead of counting as 1ww it would count as 1.3...or somthing like that

[Palem]

agree with sig warring is what makes this game fun...to play for land/nw equals an entire age of dicing/exploring and making naps with other large kingdoms that is totally boring if you ask me...

Growth kds make more attacks than you do. You'd know this if you tried it once and had some knowledge behind your claims.

The war win chart is garbage because it does nothing to measure how well a kd wars and doesn't account for the quality of the opponent. Beating some ghetto that's gone 0/5 in wars this age is worth the same as beating the ghetto cats. That's idiotic.

[Lamersen11]

Growth kds make more attacks than you do. You'd know this if you tried it once and had some knowledge behind your claims.

No they dont. You would know if you had ever topped the charts

[silverfox]

That WW's matter; you get to farm ghettos, in-turn giving you land and honour. Also shows which KDs have the balls, will-power, and activity to jump into many wars over the course of 3 months. Wars are actually the ONLY thing that makes Utopia worthwhile, so, why would you not want a WW chart?

Your argument stems from emotion rather than rational thinking, likely because you see it as an attack against your own KDs worth.

Nothing which you mentioned has a single plus point towards a war win chart being anything other than garbage. Again I'll ask you, how do you quantify what a war win is other than a simple number on a KD page?

Are you seriously telling me that every war win is of equal value, so some KD with 20 active players destroying a KD with 10 active players should hold the same worth as a KD's win where it was 25 vs. 25? Simple common sense should allow you to come to the conclusion that war wins mean sweet FA as they are in no way comparable to each other while other rankings can be, an acre is always an acre and NW points are always NW points.

Wars might be the only thing worthwhile in utopia, that's an opinion however which has no relevance to war wins.

[Sig]

Growth kds make more attacks than you do.

You seriously think the top NW KD with 0-3 wars per age makes more attacks than a KD who wars 9+ times? + all the waves in between looking for someone to press the button?

[Sig]

Silverfox, it is my opinion, thank you for restating it for me. I was never arguing about the quality of a war win, just stated the mere fact that warring more often, per age, is also challenging and adds value and diversity to Utopia.

EDIT: Since you read my retort and had nothing else to say I thought I would expand a bit, just for you, since you seem to care oh so much about my opinion. Some KDs aim for NW, we however aim for wars. We ask any kingdom in range if they want to war. Why should we care if the almighty Utopian Gods deem them as a scrub ghetto? A war is a war and we are glad to have fun and fight. It seems funny how you keep bringing up a "war's worth" and how a mere number on the WW chart does not represent anything of substance. Maybe your previous statement applies more to yourself than me. "likely because you see it as an attack against your own KDs worth." We do not care who we war, we play this game to WAR, as much as possible, rather than pumping our e-peens and creating threads here, about our KDs sense of worth and past accomplishments. Our goal is to accumulate as many wars and hopefully wins per age, as possible. We find this to be the most enjoyable way to play Utopia. Finally, the fact that you, yourself, created this disgustingly long, unnecessary thread in an attempt to boost your KDs (already massive for unknown reasons) sense of self-worth, while simultaneous knocking ours, further points out the fact that you seem to have some self-esteem issues.

Thanks for your time, quote me further if you please, I care about you too.

[Diamas]

I like wars too, but not to the point of as many as possible and no matter who we war. Challenging and fun wars are always good but I don't see the point of ghetto bashing just to get more wars. And no, I'm not one of those that think that fun wars can only be found at the top. You can always war a bigger kd for a more challenging war no matter what size you are and there are some good kd in the middle range as well. I noticed debauchery's latest war is 25v21 and 7/7 vs 0/2. I don't see the fun in that seriously. With the number and honor advantage, there's not much strategy needed and not much fun at all.

[silverfox]

Silverfox, it is my opinion, thank you for restating it for me. I was never arguing about the quality of a war win, just stated the mere fact that warring more often, per age, is also challenging and adds value and diversity to Utopia.

EDIT: Since you read my retort and had nothing else to say I thought I would expand a bit, just for you, since you seem to care oh so much about my opinion. Some KDs aim for NW, we however aim for wars. We ask any kingdom in range if they want to war. Why should we care if the almighty Utopian Gods deem them as a scrub ghetto? A war is a war and we are glad to have fun and fight. It seems funny how you keep bringing up a "war's worth" and how a mere number on the WW chart does not represent anything of substance. Maybe your previous statement applies more to yourself than me. "likely because you see it as an attack against your own KDs worth." We do not care who we war, we play this game to WAR, as much as possible, rather than pumping our e-peens and creating threads here, about our KDs sense of worth and past accomplishments. Our goal is to accumulate as many wars and hopefully wins per age, as possible. We find this to be the most enjoyable way to play Utopia. Finally, the fact that you, yourself, created this disgustingly long, unnecessary thread in an attempt to boost your KDs (already massive for unknown reasons) sense of self-worth, while simultaneous knocking ours, further points out the fact that you seem to have some self-esteem issues.

Thanks for your time, quote me further if you please, I care about you too.

You stated that "war wins matter" and then went on to try and justify that position with reasoning which does nothing to support the concept that war wins matter. I had nothing to say as arguing with people over their opinions is always a fruitless task; you're taking a defensive position as an attack against you and your KD, seem incapable of using logical though processes and ultimately will never change your view through either being stubborn or your inability to grasp what I'm actually arguing.

You shouldn't care what people think of the KDs you war, you should however be intelligent enough to know that there is a huge difference in getting a war win (speaking as if it were hypothetically possible) the "best" warring KD in the game and the "worst" warring KD in the game. While the reality is that the war win chart does nothing to differentiate this, ergo as a tool to compare the waring worth of KD's it is garbage and be extension war wins themselves are also useless.

The rest of your post is just a tirade of dribble, butt-hurt and crass hypocrisy bordering on the idiotic. If you'd like to actually construct a post which gives reasonable cause for people to think war wins mean anything then feel free to do so, if you're just going to post about how you enjoy waring then save yourself the time typing; as I think by now people get that point, aren't disputing that point and in general don't need the irrelevant comments.

[Sig]

We have beaten numerous ghettos since we formed as well, if you have been keeping tabs. You've missed my point, though. We ask ANYONE in range. If they are 25, or 20, we send a PM asking terms, regardless. If they accept, then its war..and war is fun. We never claimed to be the top warring KD, we understand how the war-rankings work..and we play to win the crown.

And Silverfox, thanks for the advice, I will save myself some typing now.. as I have said all that needs to be said already. Looking forward to round 3 next age! Cheers!

[Utopiannoob1]

Palem you know little about me to make such assumptions...I actually spent about 4 ages of my 30 or so in the game playing for kingdom attemptiing to maintain top nw/land and as we did attack orders were to basically only attack ghettos who can't retal anyone in kingdom got so bored left the game for a bit...and we warred like maybe 3 times an age if lucky..and had hostililities that lasted upto a week....I'm sure some like to play that way but I myself didn't

also in many of the kingdoms I've known who play at top land\nw provs are micromanaged so much its basically the same as a few members running all provs not a whole lot of fun but maybe worth it to some so at end of age they can be like wow look at us were huge...

So to say that land/nw only thing that matters is obsurd because not everyone wants to play that way and their are many great players who don't want to focus on getting huge

[alan03]

I'm not sure what point you're trying to make is.

What relevance does ED vs. Stoners war have with the worth of War Wins or the WW chart?

War wins do not matter yet you get FARMED Land/nw-wise by Stoners. How is that accomplishing any other goals....

[Palem]

No they dont. You would know if you had ever topped the charts

What does crowning have to do with knowing that growth kds are more active?

But that aside, let me rephrase. They SHOULD pump out more attacks than war kds, depending on how screwed up the explore formula happens to be that age.

You seriously think the top NW KD with 0-3 wars per age makes more attacks than a KD who wars 9+ times? + all the waves in between looking for someone to press the button?

Warring 9+ times is hardly standard for a "warring kd". The top war chart finish was 7.93, which will be topped by you guys. A good war kd can get it say 5-6 wars an age on average. For most kds that's the only time their activity is really on high gear. For a growth kd who is trying to crown their activity should be on high gear for the entire age and that includes making hits. They wouldn't even need to be army in-out the whole age to send out more attacks, just consistently active and attacking.

I actually spent about 4 ages of my 30 or so in the game playing for kingdom attemptiing to maintain top nw/land and as we did attack orders were to basically only attack ghettos who can't retal anyone in kingdom got so bored left the game for a bit...

So what you're saying you tried to whore, failed, then quit. You ever think maybe pumping more attacks and gaining more acres would be a good way of growing faster than the other kds if they aren't attacking as much? :p

So to say that land/nw only thing that matters is obsurd because not everyone wants to play that way and their are many great players who don't want to focus on getting huge

I didn't say land/nw is the only thing that matters. I explained why the war win chart isn't useful.

What I WILL say is that land/nw is the only current tool available that can reliably display skill for those who are attempting get to #1 in those charts, something you can't say the same about with the war win chart.
Is Debauchery a better war kd than BoB because they're higher on the war win chart? No. (I'm not BoB is the better war kd, I'm just saying that Debauchary>BoB isn't a reasonable conclusion from the chart)
Is HoH having a better whoring age than Rage? Yes.

See the difference? There are good ways to measure how well a kd can war, and the war win chart doesn't represent it.

[flutterby]

See the difference? There are good ways to measure how well a kd can war, and the war win chart doesn't represent it.

There are lots of ways to measure how well a kingdom can war, but sometimes it takes someone who's knowledgeable to be able to see it. ;)