CR vs AMA

[Anri]

Before i leave, AMA has three cool dudes i respect, Vindict, Soulhunter and Proteus.
I dont want to upset these three to much!

[faegan]

What you want to prove with this logs? After all ****s started again we loss all chances for get FAIR war with pyro. Why i need to waste mt time and war and if win need to waste more time agains much bigger disadvantage. I wanted FAIR war and its was loss. There is other cut with logs. enjoy them.

[07:37] <cJ> i think if ama-pyro war, at first ama has advantage. now pyro got a little advantage. i dont know if winner got any chance vs havoc
[07:37] <cJ> unless we make deal, loser of war must 'farm' out
[07:38] <cJ> you sure you dont want to consider both of us warring, and wwe cannot b2b and winner must fight havoc? if you think there's 0 chance for ama to win havoc (if ama-pyro fight normal. no farming out), then hmmm
[07:38] <Elit> we can make deal but its wont be so legit
[07:39] <Elit> and still its going to do alot dmg both kds
[07:39] <cJ> i dont know. one part of me says i should be happy if elit wants to LD acres to pyro and give pyro more chance to win havoc. the other part of me says i want to war ama fair and square. and try to win.
[07:39] <Elit> and i need to waste my time for war few days
[07:39] <Elit> its wont be fair war now for us
[07:39] <cJ> thing is, if we war. and let's say if it's clear 1 side win, maybe i can talk to nesta the other kingdom must 'farm' out

My offer for gave land for cf in hostile is much more legit.

Wasn't meant as a post against you, Elit. As I stated in previous posts, this age you were actually nice and fair. Upto & until this blatant dealbreak. The logpost was a reply to yet another AMA member foulmouthing PyroManiaCs for "chart shaping" and "stealing crown" with this GB. AMA members need to stop stating that PyroManiaCs is in this GB just to win, when there were clearly other options presented that could have given PyroManiaCs a chance to #1.

PyroManiaCs (AFAIK) don't do backstabbing politics; I wouldn't stand for it and neither would many others in our kingdom. As far as the log you posted is concerned, sure, that's you and cJ trying to make the best of a very bad situation without breaking any CF deals...so?

All in all, sorry for that logpost, but enough with the accusations towards PyroManiaCs because we haven't done anything wrong.

[Fury]

Wasn't meant as a post against you, Elit. As I stated in previous posts, this age you were actually nice and fair. Upto & until this blatant dealbreak. The logpost was a reply to yet another AMA member foulmouthing PyroManiaCs for "chart shaping" and "stealing crown" with this GB. AMA members need to stop stating that PyroManiaCs is in this GB just to win, when there were clearly other options presented that could have given PyroManiaCs a chance to #1.

PyroManiaCs (AFAIK) don't do backstabbing politics; I wouldn't stand for it and neither would many others in our kingdom. As far as the log you posted is concerned, sure, that's you and cJ trying to make the best of a very bad situation without breaking any CF deals...so?

All in all, sorry for that logpost, but enough with the accusations towards PyroManiaCs because we haven't done anything wrong.

You are farming acres/exploring whilst carrying the flag of justice.

If your so called fair play alliance should succeed there should be no corruption in it, very poor start.

[faegan]

Intentionally giving pyro acres on purpose so they have a chance vs. havoc while we raze havoc is called screwing over havoc not being afraid/running.

Razing CR? Where did I say that?

I am not sure why your kingdom is so arrogant, you haven;t done anything noteworthy...we've all done bigger and better things when it was harder to win than it is now.

Nope, if you are referring to noteworthy achievements such as

- threatening other kingdoms to come after them in coming ages because they don't do what you want
- dealbreak CFs

then I guess we're lacking some serious experience.

We've policed a dealbreak, advocate fair play and in the first age trying to compete in land charts, we hold a top three position. That's just about everything we've done this age.

[American Badass]

First I am glad you admit your own kd is embarrassment though I wouldn't call it a "top" kd. Your interpretation of events is completely wrong, having actually *played* in AMA I know for a fact we had good relations with havoc due to elit-zauper relationship. Why would havoc otherwise get a Y9 cf from us? This would have never happened if havoc played fair, agreed to original extension we proposed and zauper said they want to accept (after it was derailed by n00b council) and we would have fair war vs. Pyro with ~10% chance to beat Havoc after. When you are #1 kd with massive advantages from pumping all age, especially when pump was made possible with cf from AMA given in good will (havoc got cf for free they did not force it on us) least toucan do is give someone a fair chance rather than seek to erridicate them and give no chances whatsoever. There were ~4 weeks left in age, Havoc could have easily agreed to war AMA 2 weeks before eoa but no they wanted to do everything they can to make sure they war us NOW, especially after the razes happened. To me this is lack of confidence in your own ability and trying hardest to make sure you get all advantages (as if you don't have enough already). These actions only came about from Havoc's greed, disrespect, 2v1 threats, and ****play...if they kept the kd on the path which zauper set it on there would be no issues and fair 1v1 fight eoa. But when you 2v1 in past and then when your main leader leaves you act as same ghetto you once were, then this is what happens.

Also AB you talk about fairness right. Lets examine your own alliance and diplo play this age. You full know there are 6 kingdoms in range, about 3 of them with potential to crown.

How is it fair when 3 kingdoms make an eoa nap and the 4th kd cf them for 10 WEEKS! You realize this is completely unfair to the remaining two kingdoms. What this means is majority of 4 kds will get to put up cows, pump on 30% draft all age, and farm ghettos without retaliation. Whereas the two kingdoms on the outside of your little nap ring have to go through b2b2b wars and get vultured as AMA has done this age.

If you guys want to promote fairness why don't you dissolve your alliance next age, you are competing for crown and trying to prove you guys are good...where is the skill in ganging up on 1-2 kingdoms, putting them through b2b fights, and seeing who can farm ghettos the best? If you guys are good why don't you win crown without allies, or make it to #1 without allies. Alliances are fine when there is an equally balanced (or close to equally balanced) opposing force such as Abs-vs-Non Abs. Abs was the strongest alliance but non-Abs won several ages as well and did good (flogger's wins).

Seriously having your alliance around only says one thing to me that you guys are not good enough to beat kingdoms like AMA 1v1 and need alliance as an insurance policy (the events of this age have proven this).

Ok... if we are not a top kd, how can we be an embarrassment? I clearly said all the top kds are so it is one or the other, either a top kd and an embarrassment or just a ghetto. If AMA/Elit had such a good relationship with Havoc why would you dealbreak and ****play them? I am aware Zauper has left but he would of done regardless of the **** going down now. If is still his kingdom and I am going to assume if and when he is back he will take it over again.

Ok lets think about this and see if you can at least be rational to agree to some aspects to what I am about to say. Last age Rage was quite a bit behind AMA/BB and EJ. We got acres from Pew via a "farm out" mainly because, and you recognised this at the beginning of the thread (I can go dig it up), that we had pumped (We had this on our minds since Pew caught us pants down), we did a home swap pump and went at them in a position to farm them in high drafts. They wouldn't negotiate a deal for acres to CF, they wanted a free extension. Obviously you know how long a home pump strategy takes and how much GC it costs. We was not leaving them until we got at least 20k acres OR a war (we knew we would get less land and science from accepting acres for an extension). Pew would not budge but then all of a sudden we were in a war and they were learning us. We can all agree we would never know what would of happened had they warred properly. We may have got less, we might have got more but we think we would of got at least 30k acres (including WW). Now everyone assumes Rage would of moved on but we wanted to punish them for their actions earlier. Had we felt we'd not gotten our fair share and they tactically withdrew earlier, we would of gone in for MAYBE a round 2. I can't confirm this 100%. Our overall goal was to always war and beat Pew, then get in a position to war EJ afterwards as we saw them as being the weakest link from AMA/BB. We all know what happened there.

So why am I telling you all of this? It is because the events that followed that we created the alliance. We ere not to know that EJ would screw over AMA and BB. We assumed that the three would be in an alliance for a while. Just like aabs was formed to counter ABs, our alliance was created to counter ABJ.

To say we were blocking is quite hypocritical of you considering how many crowns ABs/HOH achieved by blocking for each other.

It is also laughable you saying that having the allies is because we are bad. I am not implying here AMA is bad but AMA is allied to one of the best kingdoms (BB) in the game... Come to the negotiation table Proteus and agree to some common rules so we are all clear on what is acceptable and not and we would be glad to dissolve the alliance if all members in the top could agree to freeze all actions to GB a kingdom should they fall out of line and play dirty. If we dissolved I'd also assume we would see BB vs AMA in the future.

"Seriously having your alliance around only says one thing to me that you guys are not good enough to beat kingdoms like AMA 1v1 and need alliance as an insurance policy (the events of this age have proven this)."

Maybe so, but surely AMA should enjoy 2 easy WW a round? =)

[Elit]

Anri, dont worry about your deals with us incoming ages. Simple dont expect any deal from me :P
you nonstop deal break us.

[faegan]

You are farming acres/exploring whilst carrying the flag of justice.

If your so called fair play alliance should succeed there should be no corruption in it, very poor start.

1. Exploring: was actually postponed due to this whole thing, and was now done at what? Feb 1st? Can't remember
2. Farming acres: read posts --> everyone knows what will happen once AMA backs out of crown race and promisses not to interfere

[Elit]

All in all, sorry for that logpost, but enough with the accusations towards PyroManiaCs because we haven't done anything wrong.

Cut logs and post is no cool. People cant understand something very simple: All this was done because Havoc pissed us off for noting just to secure what they have secured. WE was perfect fine with Havoc win age and was ready to war Pyro and give our best. All what we wanted is FAIR war. But again rest kds decide to not let us get fair chances for war/after war and put ****s. So why i need to waste my time and war after it? Sorry but this is one hell lame age all age for us. All what we did is result from how rest acted to us. Every one have his limits.

[Lurking Ghost]

Cut logs and post is no cool. People cant understand something very simple: All this was done because Havoc pissed us off for noting just to secure what they have secured. WE was perfect fine with Havoc win age and was ready to war Pyro and give our best. All what we wanted is FAIR war. But again rest kds decide to not let us get fair chances for war/after war and put ****s. So why i need to waste my time and war after it? Sorry but this is one hell lame age all age for us. All what we did is result from how rest acted to us. Every one have his limits.

How does it feel to be cornered ? Not good I guess.
When you try making up your own rules for everyone else to play, and your own rules for what is ok and not, this is what happens.
Why didn't you just hand over the acres as you have advocated for. Why not take the beating if you re so fair and honorable ?

You and Proteus are real dealbreakers, but the thing is, you don't call it dealbreaking, you call it justice.
Too bad other people feel justice is something else, too bad for you :/

[Nim]

So much QQ. I wonder when we'll have 100 pages.

[wickedfail]

So you think winning a crown when there are 3 "top" level kingdoms left in the game compared to 10+ kingdoms is harder? This entire age pyro had help from the n00b alliance with 3 way nap and 10 week cf with havoc while AMA played ALONE, beat the n00b alliance kds back to back from bad positions and still was in much better position than pyro majority of age up until razes came from ex-mercy/havoc player in ghetto. Where is the logic here?

This is my point. AMA was in a better position until they got razed. Did this kind of thing happen back in the day? When there were 10+ kingdoms? By the sounds of it, no ****play was. The game has changed. There is ****play in the top, you failed to account for it. That's a bad call on your part. You should have dealt with it before they dealt with you.

So I am guessing if pyro wins a crown 3 ages later when there are 2 kingdoms competing for #1 only it will still be as hard as even 1 year ago when the game was much more competitive?

There might have been stiffer competition back in the day, but I have to disagree that it was harder. As obviously there are more factors that a kingdom has to master besides warring and whoring.

And to take away credit, where credit is due is kind of petty. As long as there is competition in the game even if there is only 1 other top 10 kingdom, which is a garbage assumption by the way, a win is a win. It does not matter who you were facing that age. There were people to beat, and you beat them. That's the only thing that matters.

You are really talking out of your butt because there is nothing wrong with having cfs end on same date with multiple kingdoms and it has happened before and people hyave used it strategically to their advantage. The difference now is last few ages you have "warring" kingdoms who used to never be able to reach T5 before until all other good kds disband or take age off (Sanc, hoh, fratzia, etc.) so there is room for anyone to come into top5 if they wish and kds like pewpew come in and "claim" you with dibs and promise to 2v1 if you try to fight anyone but them. No one is entitled to fight someone when your cf ends, the end of a duration cf only means you are entitled to NOTICE nothing more , nothing less.

If your CF with pyro ended 24 hours earlier, pyro/ama noticed each other, hit and became hostile. 24 hours later when CR could have hit due to their notice being 24 hours longer, they probably wouldn't have hit. Now again, some would say yes they would, others would have said no. It's all speculation, but if they did? They'd probably be the one's getting GB not you. So this is all on your kingdom, whoever is in charge for terrible CF management. It could have EASILY been avoided if you actually thought it through. And the whole point about the winner of AMA/Pyro auto losing to CR. Well sucks to be you again! They have better CF management! They deserve to win, they put themselves in a situation that was really good. And AMA put themselves in a terrible situation and payed for it. Deal.

If suck at current game you mean avoiding ****play from other kds, yes we suck at not being ****played because kingdoms in this current era are just not good enough to beat AMA 1v1 so have to resort to other bull**** to try and win.

Congratulations! You can win a war! Maybe you should try for the WW crown, might be better suited for you. To bad that winning the land/nw crown/whatever it's called crown, takes more than winning wars. It obviously takes better cf management, ability to avoid ****play, warring, and whoring. You could have easily avoided ****play, admitted that CR played a better ROUND. Setting up cf's, whoring and staying ahead of the game etc. I don't care that if 1 vs 1 you can beat CR. Regardless if CR admits to that, they positioned themselves to have a strong advantage to help them with a potential war against you after your war vs Pyro. That's smart play. Making sure you have some sort of upper hand. And I also don't care if you fought each war at a dis-advantage, again, good on you. You guys can war. But why fight all wars at a disadvantage? That doesn't sound like a winning strategy. It also proved to be true, as I don't think AMA will crown this age.

Talk about Pyro learning to play top. Maybe you should join a n00b alliance and learn a few things about diplo, cf management, setting things up so you have advantages going into wars. Because admitted you played with a disadvantage in all your wars just smells of amateur leadership.

[guard14n]

I look forward to your retaliation in age 66 :P

As long as you do it within what is fair then there is no problem. If you create a 2v1, hit into a war, break a cf, expect retaliation like the same you are getting here. That goes for everyone too not just from your kingdom. That is not just from RPP either, it has been agreed upon by the current GB members. We'd appreciate AMA on board so that if it is Rage that plays **** you can help in a GB vs us. Just like you, I'd accept and await a GB if we play dirty, hence why we will play by the book and we'd appreciate everyone does.

You can b2b2b2b2b2b2b2b2b2b2b war us as long as you do so by not bending the rules.

To quote PS who is no longer with us :

[23:42] <PS> ud be stupid to be the only one playing by the rules when everyone eelse is making them up as they go along

We don't want to be sheep and play dirty to crown. We'd rather crown legit and have people congratulate us than to say we achieved it via bad play.

So as long as we dont make deals with u we can hump u whenever and however we want right... good to know.

[Dumdidam]

so much anger and injustice feeling from ama players but no single kd stand up for them. they should get a better rep/pr person for this forum war or maybe they should look into mirror.

[TheOne]

Its funny how people from ur own "fair" alliance are saying this whole thing is a setup for pyro to get the crown. cJ already said that he was the one that organised the gb. Here is the way i see it:
-Havoc goes to every kd asking for help vs us (fact)
- Pyro does the math and since they were thinking we gonna raze the land said - hey we get the crown and we wont bother interfering in this mess.
- Simians are led by Anri.... No comment there
- Nesta and cJ find out we aint razing land ... hmm thats not good 1v1 vs big ama is impossible. We gather people up for GB
- Pyro and the rest tell havoc they will help if bla bla bla bla - Pyro gets 80% chance for crowning at least (100 if possible).
- AMA offers pyro a deal where pyro will get 50-60% chance to win the age + fair play will be restored - pyro said no (why get 50% when we get 80-100% from GB)
- GB starts and all show their true collors: Rage is acting up for their team and holding a grudge about us destroying them in 1v1, pyro goes for their crown riding the fair play horse, Simians are just monkeys, Havoc is trying to make points with the alliance hoping to go in next age, ex rage, havoc, siminans and pyro players from deep in the ghettoes are called out as well.
- What will happen next - pyro will pump up, war dmg-ed havoc and propably win the age by powerplaying and alliance help. GJ Nesta cJ u deserve this CROWN and this crown alone - no other way to get it so im down with u.


Cuddoes to Pew Pew for not going for this retarded GB. Earned my respect (cant even believe i say it :D).

get your facts right before you slander someone. because you just posted a whole load of bull****. i already told you that you are taking my statement out of context which u quoted many pages earlier. i told u that i beleived cr only needed pyro for this gb to be successful, but the others can join in if they agree with it. and you said i organised the gb? lol, in fact, doesnt mater who organised the gb tbh

[Meep]

Cut logs and post is no cool. People cant understand something very simple: All this was done because Havoc pissed us off for noting just to secure what they have secured. WE was perfect fine with Havoc win age and was ready to war Pyro and give our best. All what we wanted is FAIR war. But again rest kds decide to not let us get fair chances for war/after war and put ****s. So why i need to waste my time and war after it? Sorry but this is one hell lame age all age for us. All what we did is result from how rest acted to us. Every one have his limits.

You hit into someone's conflicts repeatedly after promising not to, then throw up your cows without even CFing this person the next age, and somehow you're the victim yet again?

You are literally delusional:
"A delusion is a belief held with strong conviction despite superior evidence to the contrary."

-You ****played Remote repeatedly after promising not to
-You made no attempt to CF him the next age and threw up cows while he was in range
-He exacted his revenge

That's YOUR FAULT, not anbody else's. Not Pyro's. Not CR's.

Your losing the ability to win a 1v1 war against Pyro or CR was 100% undeniably your own ****ing fault. It doesn't matter how well you think you played this age or what you think you deserved this age. You tooled over one to many people, and you got bit.

Stop trying to play with words and act like the victim when you screwed yourself over and then decided to be a spoiled little child and ruin the age for everyone else.