Are people just not inviting into abandoned slots (maybe because there aren't many) or do they just not see the option? Out of like 86 kds recruiting only 2 are inviting into existing provs
e.g
Requirements
Adopt existing province Human / Tactician
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Are people just not inviting into abandoned slots (maybe because there aren't many) or do they just not see the option? Out of like 86 kds recruiting only 2 are inviting into existing provs
e.g
Requirements
Adopt existing province Human / Tactician
I agree with jdorje about not allowing full kds to have recruiting campaigns to be problematic. I have a player leaving and if I could only use the in-game recruiting mechanic my hands would be tied until the spot opens. It's something that needs addressed.
i wish i had invites. id try it .Bishop why not give all the kds with holes a extra invite or 2 to go along with this to try it out.
Every time i log in the number of kds that " want me " seems to go up. right at 100 now wildly enough.
From above someone mentioned the log in numbers and time log in amounts. i miss those.Used to have nice showing at the end of each age in the kingdom to see if anyone could come close to my numbers each age :)
After getting a chance to use the recruiting mechanic I can say its a good idea that needs quite a bit of polishing. What others have said about the lack of communication is spot on but on top of that why can't I see who it is that's applying to be in my kd? I don't see why any anonymity would be needed there...
anon seems bad in general.
i think at least making an activity meter would help a lot - something like average time spent online per day.
i know on #tactic you said that this wasn't implemented because new players have no activity, but that's what they are. new players. most serious kds aren't going to actively recruit new players no matter what system you put in place, so there might as well be a way to tell how active the people who have been playing for at least an age are.
overall i think the success of this feature will depend on what can be gained from using it instead of forums/irc by using in game data.
That can be very misleading to begin with, you can have someone that has army in and out all the time but dont spend more than say 1 hour online and then you can have nubs like me that spends quite some hours online in utopia but never bother with having army in/out. So that would make me more "active" ..Quote:
i think at least making an activity meter would help a lot - something like average time spent online per day.
haha i get what you mean, but that seems like a pretty extreme example
Yeah remove anon that way they can see your kingdom too.
120 characters is just SO FEW.
..
I'd be ecstatic to see some flexibility in the recruiting system. As for activity meter, that would be cool to have to reference, but not to necessarily hinge the search parameters on that. I.e. let people be honest about their activity so they aren't auto-locked out of being able to search for a KD that has a high activity requirement... BUT give me a little graph what this person's activity is, and I will decide whether to take it with a grain of salt or actually pay attention to it.
Options, flexibility, being able to interview and set up waiting lists. It must be a much more dynamic system. Give us the basic simplicity of the current system, with room to expand, investigate and interview, and be very thorough with our decision-making if we choose. All the top KDs must be thorough and careful with their recruiting.
Am I asking too much? :P Implement even half of the good suggestions in this board and in-game recruitment will be a PRIMO feature and will (hopefully) have a positive impact on the culture and fun of Utopia. Get people matched up with a KD they can succeed in! That's always the biggest challenge and the biggest reward of this game.... :)
THIS DESERVED TO GET PUT HERE:::
HERE I EVEN MADE YOUR KD FEATURE BETTER WITHOUT ALL THE EXTRA HOOPLA THAT WAS JUST IMPLEMENTED AS A FEATURE.
HOW ABOUT YOU ADD AN EXTRA LABEL AT THE BOTTOM OF THE LIST ON THE PROVINCE DETAILS PAGE (WHICH IS AVAILABLE TO EVERYONE-SO NOT ABUSEABLE) WITH A DROPDOWN BOX TO SELECT LOOKING FOR KD / OR/ NOT LOOKING FOR KD,,, THEN LABEL IT "RECRUITMENT STATUS"..
IF CANDIDATES SEND YOU THEIR APP AND COMMUNICATION IS THAT MUCH EASIER.. YOU ALSO HAVE A VIEW ON THE POTENTIAL CANDIDATES CURRENT PROVS AS A BIT OF EXTRA EVIDENCE OF CANDIDATE WORTHINESS.. ex
Da lulz (X:X)
This province has no motto
Province details
Ruler lulzsec
Give a gift
Race Human
Land 1110 acres
Net Worth 194,685gc
Net Worth/Acre 161gc
Nobility Lord
Recruitment Status Not Looking Select Recruitment Status | Looking |
| Not Looking|
i just simplified and made your "recruitment feature" and made it 1000x better at the same time. with a lot less code ..
Would make it a lot easier feature for monarchs to recruit future members, and vice versa, than the current feature( a good attempt at in game recruitment) ...but it needs to be simplified...
Last edited by JAZZE; Yesterday at 23:17.
Can I suggest possibly changing this whole system to people looking create these infomation boxes and then monach just invite who they like the look of?
IE same system but Applicants create a recruitment campaign. All kingdoms see it. All kingdoms can invite that person. Applicant gets to decline / accept and auto join kingdom (You can only invite if you have an invite)
Applicant leaves :
Role :
Contact :
Description :
Activity :
Experience :
ALL KINGDOMS GET TO SEE ALL APPLICANTS.
you could very easily add something like that to whats existing. I.e. all players who want to be recruited must create a recruitment profile. You then either send that profile to a kd (ie with contact info such as irc/msn whatever) or u can post it as "looking" Then in the same way players can currently look for kds, monarchs can activly recruit players, via big list of players.Quote:
Originally Posted by American Badass
Also as it stands now there almost way to sort through kds you want to join. only "big" kds are going to activly recruit succesfully. would be nice to have ALL the kds on a single page, in a list form. kinda like prov's in a kd. Then u see Size, goal, requreiments..., monarch msg. sortable by any category.
American Badass and persian.. I THOUGHT I JUST SUGGESTED THIS WITH MY POST... THO MINE IS A LOT SIMPLER AND EASIER TO IMPLEMENT
its the same concept I'm just done outside the players profile and done via a "recruitment" profile......Quote:
Originally Posted by JAZZE
then my additional suggestion to that was was instead of the WALL of text and multiple pages like it is now, or to be viewable on the persons prov page via "status" was to take a collect all people who are "actively" looking for kds on a single page viewable by monarchs to show
.......................Applicant.....Current prov..........preferred roll......Experience.....Activity..knowledge...Comment (add irc/msn here)....
Msg the player...NAME.........New/link to profile... Any/A,T/M......and so on
Have ALL players who are activly looking be in a list that is sortable by each column so monarchs can quickly scan to find who they want and msg the kd.
Heck i'd prefer something like that over the current walls of text for the kd joins like
Msg the monarch....KDNW(rankings in the 1-10 like it is now)...Land...WW....Honor....Kd goal..Willing to train new players...Desired( Experience..Activity..Knowledge...role)..Comment (click to expand)....
.
That way ALL kds are listed on one page and a new player can sort by all info or desired activity level to find a kd faster
Doesnt hurt small kds as you dont have to click 10+ pages to get to their recruitment, just have to scroll down.
You'd end up with a list of
KD...Land...WW....Honor....Kd goal..Willing to train new players...Desired( Experience..Activity..Knowledge...role).........Comment (click to expand)....
4......3.........9.........4.........War.........Yes...............................................0 .................3..........4........Attacker...Join #KD NAME to talk
5......10.......8.........5.........Growth......Yes..............................................3.. ...............2..........5.........Attacker...Join #KD NAME to talk
I have played in a lot of ghettos. There is no danger that the recruitment page will remind people they are in a ghetto. It will be obvious from war flops, the kingdom page, the forums, and frequently the monarch messages.
When I start defecting I usually end up bouncing through 5 or 6 kingdoms within an age. That means dumping my ghetto early so that I am in a kingdom where I intend to start the next age. If the recruitment tool works I my be able to slow down the defection rate.
I am not going to spend $10 to take a blind chance at some guy who has a name, race, personality, that possibly does not fit with my kd without having a chance to talk to him and make sure he changes to what I need before he comes.....
good idea but we must be able to communicate with the recruits before you expect us to spend money to move them into the kd...
Then stick your contact details in your recruitment ad?Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluefaerydust
cause its moar work?
This is probably way more difficult than just making it so kd's have the option to choose people's race/pers(if the recruit has ok'd joining a KD that does that), but it could be cool if you expanded the in-game chat to recruitment. Basically have it like an in game IRC chatroom that you can open on the recruitment page, and then can pm individual kd's(goes to monarch) and then the monarch can respond(private messages are saved in a log that both have).
Or easier and probably better: have it so someone looking for a kd gets anonymous mail from monarchs after they've sent their message asking to be invited. This would allow a little back and forth between recruiter and recruitee. Would also allow both to see how long it takes for the other to get back which gives a better idea of activity. Even this paired with letting monarch select which race/pers would make people more willing to spend the money to invite.
Also, are you guys tracking how many provs are getting into kd's via the new recruitment tool? I'd love to see that after a bit.
There's nothing wrong with this system. Applicants can either send their loc or if you can put your contact details in your campaign. I guess you could even put in your kd loc if you wanted. It seems some people want to complicate matters as a matter of principle.
The fact that it is not conducive to top kds interviewing people, well, come on, you've always filled your slots, and your waiting list, just fine before. Yes, I think this recruitment process does favour the ghettos slightly, who are going to be less fussy - but they are the very folk who don't have a full Utopia list of players they can approach, so I think there's nothing wrong with that.
current system still needs to be simplified ...
adding recruitment status to province details page is a good idea
There were a lot of good idea's above that address this on the games-end instead of sticking it to the players to figure out. I was under the impression this thread was about getting feedback, but, after reading your opening post I get the feeling that's not actually what you're interested in.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bishop
To me, Like jdorje said, I can't use this system. It wasn't designed for a full kingdom to be able to replace players. I'm actually ok with this, because that to me just means it will finally address the lower to mid-tier kingdoms ability to actually get players. Players have complained about that for some time, but, realistically, top kingdoms will find players without this system, so I just don't mind not being able to use it.
After looking at it, though, I think it could be improved. "Applying" to a kingdom should at least send an in-game message to the monarch from the applying players province so they can exchange some in-game messages at the least before accepting an applicant. This could be better improved by a private 'forum' between recruiter and recruitee directly through this system, but I think this would be too large of a request at this time.
Adding a 'actively looking' or 'not interested' tag in your province would be a good idea. This was mentioned a few times above.
Anonymity should be optional. For example, Anonymous recruitment messages should be as they are. This would allow a kingdom early age to say "join #chan" without giving away their loc. At the same time, having it say "Kingdom (##:##)" and even land/nw/honor rank and current wins/wars in a non-anon recruitment message could be just as handy.
Anonymity for applicants should be removed completely.
Having the option built into the game for the applicant to pay for the invite (automatically deducts 40 credits from applicant upon accepting invite, meaning applicant needs the credits to xfer) would also be beneficial. It at least shows that they are taking a risk in hopes for the best, as it comes out of their pocket. Leap of faith, if you will.
========
Still, having this system is better than not having it. Props for that. But please don't ask people to discuss it and scoff at them for doing such, eh?
BTW, the time you most want to use this as a ghetto/20-prov kd is when someone up and leaves out of nowhere and you don't want a random to come in. Would be nice to be able to lock out randoms now that we have this.
I'm sorry you got that impression, nothing could be further from the truth. There are some good ideas here that we will be reviewing with an eye to incorporating them. Similarly, there are some ideas that do not fit in with the goal of this system.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ezzerland
We will be tweaking the system, but not to a large extent. It serves no purpose to overcomplicate it and barrage new players with information they cannot understand. Many of the requests you make here are solved simply by adding that request for info into your own recruitment message.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ezzerland
I hardly feel it is "scoffing" to put forward a solution to a perceived issue.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ezzerland
I strongly believe you need ;
IRC Name
MSN Address
Yes people can post in the 120 character field but from the 7 applicants I received 4 included an email address even though it is what I stated in the description. Although this seperates the non readers / non listeners I'm sure people are just clicking every single kingdoms apply button.
Possibly limit it so applicants can only apply to 3 kingdoms maximum at a time?
Also, does the order of the kingdoms recruiting get placed on most relevant to person looking first? If it does great, if not I think it should? OR to make it fair for all kingdoms make the ads randomise so each kingdom gets a fair chance to recruit. OR place on page 1 kingdoms with 20 people, page 3 kingdoms with 22 etc and kingdoms with 24 provinces on page 12. Atm I don't get why my kingdom is always on page 2? Not complaining as it is better than page 13...
You will find that a lot of people will flat out refuse to expose their personal email address to random people, or just dont/cant use IRC. Any communication would have to be optional and handled ingame. This is obviously an issue for those without a province.Quote:
Originally Posted by American Badass
Understand that but it'd then eliminate the people applying to that kingdom and if they see them fields may be more inclined to leave the info there or think twice about applying. I believe both shouldn't HAVE to be filled in.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bishop
Would also be nice for kingdoms to have tick boxes for Required programs...
MSN - Tick box which shows MSN is a must
IRC - Tick Box which shows IRC is a must
PIMP - Tick box which shows PIMP is a must
The more info king / applicant knows about each other the more likely the 2 should match when looking... then in years to come when feature is fully complete you could introduce search options for applicants :
IE
- Must use msn, only kingdoms with MSN are shown etc etc
Ok, we just are not going to do that.
Well it should be something considered if you hope for the game to grow. A working system in place relatively early to make searching easier for a new player joining the game is better than them getting bored going through page after page of kingdoms (Yes there is only 59 now, but I'd like to think the developers are ambitious enough to see the numbers grow to 10s of thousands again and one day see 500 kingdoms recruiting, would be nice to be able to search / make it better)
We are not considering forcing players to have to use external communication tools. It'll be handled in-game if its done.
I do not really see how having the fields with (Optional) next to it is forcing people to use MSN / IRC...? As it stands it seems you want kings to invite people to kingdoms for $10, then have them killed off when they find out they wont use MSN / IRC. The way this game offers no king "protection" from losing his / her money is why imo, not many people will buy credits to invite new people.
gg. I really didn't expect a genuine response from you. I appreciate this.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bishop
To me, that small limited space should be used to... I dunno.. appear inviting? It seems strange to me to have to cram it with "We're ##:##, IRC chan #chan on XSERVER. Don't apply w/o telling us who you are. We want x" Seems rather.. garbled to me. Having the ability to click their msg and be taken to their kd page or something would give a good bit of info, and I don't imagine it being too hard for the invite to also send an in-game msg? This solves your "keeping it in the game" issue, and helps clean up some space for us to actually communicate something in our message, no?Quote:
Originally Posted by Bishop
This is more about approach and perception. Since this is a forum, things sometimes can get a bit tricky.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bishop
Perhaps the in-game recruitment do with some more changes.
1) allow monarchs to type in more than 120 words
2) Have more details like race, personality and time zone etc
3) allow monarchs to interact with the applicant so that they could find out more
Thanks
Activity is now measured and you can order kds by nw, acres, honor and war wins. We will have some more changes, but not for a while yet.
yay part of my suggestions got through....still wish you'd add the same sort by requirements on Experience, Daily activity, Game knowledge, but thats for a later time.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bishop
On a side note, while i love the little bar graph showing rankings they arent very intuitive. As in i could use a key to remind me that its in Nw, Land, Honor,WW order and what the actual number is that's not the little hover over box as it takes 10-15 seconds to show up via my Firefox settings. (and wont show up at all via mobile) Small complaint though as i'd rather see the extra sorting first.
Mentioned this on IRC, but only 4 kd's are currently accessible to newbs. I think this could be a great tool to get newbs into kd's that are good enough to help them and get them into the game, but with only 4 accepting newbs(and 2 of them seem to be as ghetto as any random) it basically asks that they join and then use it again. I don't think it will be self-correcting on the monarch side, because i they put the lowest activity "any" than more serious people wouldn't want to go to their kd. Something on the monarch side that they can click which says "willing to help newbs" and then makes the bar not a requirenment for actual newbs would be nice.
Its far too early to tell how many will recruit people with no recorded activity yet. Lets give it a while before we make any snap decisions.
Thats strange... I got 5 uniques (45m away from 6) in a min time war, train troops and sci every tick in post war CF and it says I'm not active enough for a KD with 3/3 activity.. haha not that I want to switch the KD I'm in but I think something is broken there. :-)
I also have colleagues who have no life and are here all the time and still get 2/3.
It will take 5 days for the new system to recognize your lvl of activity. Right now, anyone recruiting who put maximum activity required will have noone send them a message.
Nah, its 5 days for new players to build up activity levels. To get 3/3 you gotta be active over an 18 hour period - this is why its called hardcore ;)