Fratzia vs ED

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Originally Posted by Elit

There is huge difference. Fratzia wont trained up and rebuild. Mean they wont go train up and chances to hit you OOW is close to zero.

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Again, that is the risk you take.

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Originally Posted by ciupi

by ur logic i can freely say there is nothing wrong in hitting into a WAR!!! the rules say only have lower gains doing that not that u are not allowed to do that!

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Indeed, but again community is, or was, against it. As you pointed out :)

And then by yours, ED/Pyro and ED/Pew were doing nothing wrong either. Looks like apologies all around are in order.

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Originally Posted by Elit

Feel free to pay me for not play ;)

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I rather know that you are poor in life and it shall keep me satisfied

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Originally Posted by Runefire

Again, that is the risk you take.



Indeed, but again community is, or was, against it. As you pointed out :)

And then by yours, ED/Pyro and ED/Pew were doing nothing wrong either. Looks like apologies all around are in order.

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appologies? LOL...i'm just laughing at ur frustration and at the fact that u try to turn the server agaist us when it's not us that abuse the system, it's ED...so please cry more and make my day ;)

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Originally Posted by Runefire

Looks like apologies all around are in order.

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Sure you can give me apology, special Part. He talked so rude to me last time in irc. I'm still stressed from it!

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Originally Posted by Anri

I rather know that you are poor in life and it shall keep me satisfied

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So basically any KD surfer in future from my play is pure your fault for turn down my good offer!

So Ive read about 57 posts by elit now, I'll sum them up: ED is lame. Havoc is lame. Sanc was lame. Fratzia is lame. Pewpew is lame. Swea is lame. Pyro is not lame cause they are just noobs. Im not sure if he has mentioned any other kd, I might have forgotten. If he did; they are lame. AMA is really cool, and justified.
Whenever something doesnt suit AMA, its lame and unfair to ama, regardless if they are involved or not.

Tip: since you are only ever capable of reasoning from a narcesistic perspective, I think a game consisting of only two sides would suit you a lot better. Means you cant get screwed by a third party.

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Originally Posted by ciupi

appologies? LOL...i'm just laughing at ur frustration and at the fact that u try to turn the server agaist us when it's not us that abuse the system, it's ED...so please cry more and make my day ;)

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Sorry but what system are ED abusing?

You're so full of **** that it's unreal, here's how the game is:

- You have lower gains OOW, because wars are intended to be 1v1 engagements between 2 KDs.

That's it. Feel free to point to where in the rules or where devs have said that a KD MUST war another based on receiving their notice? Oh wait you can't? There's no abuse going on outside of your head and the fact that you think you can make up your own game play rules which suit you.

Does it suck for Fratzia that they trained and then didn't have a target? Yes for them it does, but so what? Would it suck for ED to have to sit there and be farmed by a bigger and more pumped KD? Yes, but Fratzia doesn't have a problem with that.

There's always going to be someone who loses so other KDs gain, you don't have some divine right to get what you want just because you serve someone notice that you'll be ending your CF with them. The top KDs are already pathetic enough that everyone has to CF everyone else so they can all nonce around running low draft and getting sci (which the rest of the server can never have the luxuary of doing) but you're also content with spending 9 weeks doing nothing and then throwing your toys out the pram under the guise of "stopping cheating" just because you actually had to train troops and didn't have a war to use them in.

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Originally Posted by silverfox

Sorry but what system are ED abusing?

You're so full of **** that it's unreal, here's how the game is:

- You have lower gains OOW, because wars are intended to be 1v1 engagements between 2 KDs.

That's it. Feel free to point to where in the rules or where devs have said that a KD MUST war another based on receiving their notice? Oh wait you can't? There's no abuse going on outside of your head and the fact that you think you can make up your own game play rules which suit you.

Does it suck for Fratzia that they trained and then didn't have a target? Yes for them it does, but so what? Would it suck for ED to have to sit there and be farmed by a bigger and more pumped KD? Yes, but Fratzia doesn't have a problem with that.

There's always going to be someone who loses so other KDs gain, you don't have some divine right to get what you want just because you serve someone notice that you'll be ending your CF with them. The top KDs are already pathetic enough that everyone has to CF everyone else so they can all nonce around running low draft and getting sci (which the rest of the server can never have the luxuary of doing) but you're also content with spending 9 weeks doing nothing and then throwing your toys out the pram under the guise of "stopping cheating" just because you actually had to train troops and didn't have a war to use them in.

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again i say: BY UR LOGIC, if we would have broken the NOTICE deal and waved u (cause notice isn't anywhere in the rules!) you would have come here and CRY just like u do now!

silverfox, ED made very risk move 3 times in raw. Its worked first 2 but not last one. Your play is not moral so you cant expect all kds to act moral to you too.
How i told you, next time run proper if you feel like run and there wont be any risk for your kd.

How to win an age with less then $150:

1. Build 3 kds ( easy to do now )
2. Farmd kd 2 and kd 1 once a month
3. By year 6 you own the top 10 provinces in the world and power-play everyone.

How these 3 steps are translated to what pewpew and ed do?

1. Find 2 idiots that are as idiot as you
2. Farm each others and grow big provinces both kds. ONLY do it after you explore ****load of core acres so your bigs have what to hit
3. NEVER war anyone else so you don't get farmed and if you EVER feel a threat use one of your friends to war and do what point 2 says.

Oh and yes ... if a bug happens and someone hits you in war ... cry about it and make everyone think you're the victim and they are the bad bad people!

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Originally Posted by ciupi

appologies? LOL...i'm just laughing at ur frustration and at the fact that u try to turn the server agaist us when it's not us that abuse the system, it's ED...so please cry more and make my day ;)

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As soon as someone thinks youre an asshat, they play in ED? Sorry to dissapoint, but disliking you is more widespread then that it seems.

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Originally Posted by zmasternr1

It's quite obvious coss is full of sh"#. He saw an opportunity to get some free easy acres on their biggest provs. Will give them a nice help against ama and BB.
Each of their big provs suicided into our war and added like 1.5k acres each to their biggest provs. They didn't even bother ano their hits because they knew we couldn't ambush being tied up in war.

I hope other top kds take action against this kind of cheating. This is just like fratzia behaved back in the old days...I remember when they got 25 provs deleted due to extensive xlogging lol

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Ur math skills are off the chart bro. One 8k prov in Fratzia gained 1k in two waves, the other two like 500-600a judging from the paper posted by a Pyromaniac player in the other thread and comparing it to their kd screen. Hardly looks like "each of their big provs suicided and added like 1500a each". Looks more like Pyro hit the big fat hybrids in ED right away, and Fratzias big provs got screwed on their gains rather then found easy acres.

Also getting 17k out of a conflict that would had yielded them like 40k-50k aint exactly "getting some free easy acres on their biggest provs. Will give them a nice help against ama and BB".

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Originally Posted by ciupi

appologies? LOL...i'm just laughing at ur frustration and at the fact that u try to turn the server agaist us when it's not us that abuse the system, it's ED...so please cry more and make my day ;)

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Seems you are the more frustrated one out of this. Your kingdoms actions prove it.

This isn't about crying or anything. I am not in ED. Just about me having some entertainment between Utopia, TV shows and work. So thanks, I think I will keep posting.

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Originally Posted by Parth

As soon as someone thinks youre an asshat, they play in ED? Sorry to dissapoint, but disliking you is more widespread then that it seems.

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No fair I was about to call him asshat too

You all need to calm down a little.

I hope none of you are experiencing any RL stress because someone somewhere did something you didn't agree with.

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Originally Posted by Palem

You all need to calm down a little.

I hope none of you are experiencing any RL stress because someone somewhere did something you didn't agree with.

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Nope, looks like its all utopia related stress on Fratzia's end. Won't somebody think of the children!

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Originally Posted by Palem

You all need to calm down a little.

I hope none of you are experiencing any RL stress because someone somewhere did something you didn't agree with.

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Im not involved in all drama and still feel so stressed! Cant imagine how is Feel Part and rest people in ED. Its why im help them to get rid from all stress in forum.

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Originally Posted by ciupi

again i say: BY UR LOGIC, if we would have broken the NOTICE deal and waved u (cause notice isn't anywhere in the rules!) you would have come here and CRY just like u do now!

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Are you really that stupid that you're trying to compare a KD agreement to not attack each other (and enforced by ingame mechanics that allow you to CF other KDs) with the fact that you think you should be allowed to attack someone in war with another KD just because you told them that you'd be ending your CF?

You made a deal with ED to not attack each other and to give 48 hours notice before dropping the CF, you had no other agreement so why you think you should be entitled to anything more is pretty unbelievable but to then try and make out that ED are actually cheating in someway is asinine at best.

If you make trash CF agreements then it's your problem not anyone elses.

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Originally Posted by Elit

silverfox, ED made very risk move 3 times in raw. Its worked first 2 but not last one. Your play is not moral so you cant expect all kds to act moral to you too.
How i told you, next time run proper if you feel like run and there wont be any risk for your kd.

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Google translate still hasn't updated with an option for Elitish, so I don't really know what the hell half of that means.

Just wonder are Fratzia offered CF to ED and Are ED asked for any kinds CF or hits continue?
You can keep share arguments in forum but its wont back any. My suggestion to ED is to go work some kind CF or Fratzia can keep hit you all war.

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Originally Posted by Elit

There is not perfect Solution when its hapend.

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But there is a perfect solution, rape hard PewPew and keep raping them until they're nothing but a speck of dust. Disregard any conflicts(real or otherwise) they enter into, eventually they'll either disband or be so small they can't possibly be a threat or influence anything. Mission Accomplished.

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Originally Posted by Runefire

I don't see the difference between 24 hours and 1 hour, as long as it is before end of the deal, it is legitimate. I see this as a risk you take for making a notice deal.

If you think they will run, offer a new deal and don't train up. Or train and do something else. Or leave it open and see if you can jump them another time, or risk them doing the same to you.

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The difference is -75% gains.

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Originally Posted by Runefire

So what? That is the risk you pay for making a notice deal. If you make a deal and notice, you should expect people will do all they can to make an outcome that works best for them. That is the game. If you want to farm kingdoms on your schedule, don't make deals.

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Yes and getting hit into war is the risk you pay when you try to run, if you don't want to risk it then do some diplomacy and fork out a few acres in exchange for an extended CF, thats how things used to work and I'm pretty sure most kingdoms not holding a grudge would settle for that.

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Originally Posted by silverfox

Are you really that stupid that you're trying to compare a KD agreement to not attack each other (and enforced by ingame mechanics that allow you to CF other KDs) with the fact that you think you should be allowed to attack someone in war with another KD just because you told them that you'd be ending your CF?

You made a deal with ED to not attack each other and to give 48 hours notice before dropping the CF, you had no other agreement so why you think you should be entitled to anything more is pretty unbelievable but to then try and make out that ED are actually cheating in someway is asinine at best.

If you make trash CF agreements then it's your problem not anyone elses.



Google translate still hasn't updated with an option for Elitish, so I don't really know what the hell half of that means.

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I really don't see how u fail to see who is the stupid one here. We are not the ones that made a messy CF agreement here. We made an agreement and we were ready to deliver when notice was served, ED instead did only wrong moves and saw they can't do anything else then farmout so they decided they can run and get away...AGAIN! Oh no u don't! To summ it up : Fratzia didn't break any rules and doesn't care about ED's opinion just because they try to ****play and play victims! As others have said: if u want to run and avoid diplo, do it properly and accept the consequences and stop crying!

P.S, If i were u i would be happy we stopped the hits after 2 waves and we just took 18k acres...less then half we would have taken from you if it was going for diplo/war.
that being said, i go out and enjoy some fun time with some friends while u can cry more here

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Originally Posted by ciupi

As others have said: if u want to run and avoid diplo, do it properly and accept the consequences and stop crying!

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Just want to point out that the people that are saying this **** play every chance they get, cry, and don't like consequences. It's a false face; justifying **** play with **** play and complaining about **** play while **** playing.

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Originally Posted by ciupi

I really don't see how u fail to see who is the stupid one here.

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"When you are dead, you don't know that you are dead. It is difficult only for others...

It's the same when your are stupid." - Anon

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Originally Posted by Ezzerland

Just want to point out that the people that are saying this **** play every chance they get, cry, and don't like consequences. It's a false face; justifying **** play with **** play and complaining about **** play while **** playing.

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i agree we played ****play with ****play, but sorry i couldn't bring them flowers for what they did in this case ;)

It's the current web of utopia. No one can be a 'better person'

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Originally Posted by silverfox

No, you're logic is utterly retarded because you seem to believe just because AMA did something then every other KD should also be bound by that rule.

ED noticed you as they were allowed to under the agreement you had, there's not agreement that ED can't notice you if you just got out of war or lost land to a final wave, you just like to tag that on there and call it immoral because it makes you look better while the reality is it's irrelevant what position AMA were in, why do you think you're the person who writes the moral code for utopia?

It was your choice to not run from ED, no-one forced you to sit there, no-one forced you to not re-engage PewPew, so stop trying to make your own choices a factor that anyone else should care about. ED were in no obligation to give you a 2nd war, you just make up all these stupid as **** conditions that KDs should be bound to about how you should be allowed your 2nd wars vs. people, no-one cheated you outside of your own delusions of grandeur that make you think anyone owes you something.

You're just an idiot who likes to make up reasons why you deserve to get an advantage for your own KD, if you're stupid enough to notice a KD without an agreement to war once it expires and without knowing if that KD has any outs then you deserve to **** yourself over by training and not having a target. Serving notice doesn't mean you get a war, it means you're telling a KD that you're going to break your CF which logically means you normally intend to wave them, the KD being served isn't under any obligation to sit there and not war anyone else.

You keep crying that ED and PewPew were in "fake wars", yet neither KD has been punished for either of the wars. Both KDs knowing that the other one can't damage a certain portion of their KD doesn't mean a war is fake, how many other caveats are you willing to make up as you go along to decide when a war is fake or not? If a KD enters war knowing their bank can't be touched then is it a fake war, because they're getting war protection with no down sides? All 3 of EDs last wars have been real, I come back from the USA and I'm under 400 acres and almost dead, just because EDs banks gained protection doesn't make it a ****ing fake war you tool.

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+1

Sums it up rather lovely. It's quite clear to everyone who has atleast 2 working brain cells, or more, that Elit, AMA, and Fratzia are simply a bunch of self-righteous as*holes who are making up rules as they go, with the addition of ruining the game in the progress.

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Originally Posted by ciupi

I really don't see how u fail to see who is the stupid one here. We are not the ones that made a messy CF agreement here. We made an agreement and we were ready to deliver when notice was served, ED instead did only wrong moves and saw they can't do anything else then farmout so they decided they can run and get away...AGAIN! Oh no u don't! To summ it up : Fratzia didn't break any rules and doesn't care about ED's opinion just because they try to ****play and play victims! As others have said: if u want to run and avoid diplo, do it properly and accept the consequences and stop crying!

P.S, If i were u i would be happy we stopped the hits after 2 waves and we just took 18k acres...less then half we would have taken from you if it was going for diplo/war.
that being said, i go out and enjoy some fun time with some friends while u can cry more here

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You had an agreement with ED that you would be CFed and if either side wanted to break it then they needed to give 48 hours notice, that is all you had. You didn't have an agreement to war, you didn't have an agreement that after notice expired then the serving KD would get to wave regardless of the others position.

I have no issue with knowing who the idiot is, it's quite clearly you because you've some how managed to extrapolate the concept that "CF ends in 48 hours" into "CF ends in 48 hours and we'll wave you regardless of what your KD is doing". ED doesn't owe you anything other than respecting the CF for the duration which was agreed and having gave you 48 hours notice if we wanted to cancel it.

Did Fratzia break any rules? No, because the devs are never going to stop people from hitting OOW. However ED hasn't broken any rules either, you're now in the realm of opinion over what is and isn't acceptable in the eyes of the community, almost every player will agree that OOW hits into a real war isn't acceptable while very few will agree that just because you've noticed someone then they have to sit there and wait for you to wave them.

What you're basically saying is that next time you (or any other KD) is in a war then ED can just sit and wave you, or hey maybe when you go to war then people can just notice you and once it expires then they can just start hitting into your war because otherwise it's not fair on them if they can't wave you once the notice is up.

You can always spot a dip**** when you need to post moronic crap about your real life, I'm glad you have friends and need to inform people on the internet about them, would you like a gold star sticker to go with that? Maybe you can get a girlfriend and keep us up to date about how that's going too?

silverfox sounds like the most sane person in here.

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Originally Posted by munk

silverfox sounds like the most sane person in here.

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Munk is drunk!

silverfox, there is no need from all this long explains. Wont change any atm. There is noting illegal if you run from notice, but you need to make it smart. Basically you made Fratzia train/rebuild and run in war 1h before notice expire. Its really risk and stupid. Train time is 14h in fort stance with IA. Run in war 15h before notice expire is when You can safe run and being 100% sure there is no chance Fratzia to go mad and hit you oow, because they have good option left: drop all solds and keep pump. How you run its clear troll Fratzia.
You **** play them, they did same to you. End story.

Did any1 in Fratzia pay Elit to advocate for them? ;)

I just realized that if Pewpew hadn't gone to war with Strippers last age and let us war them we wouldn't be having such forum threads now. Palem's fault. Boosting forum activity conspiracy!

I'll say it again...people need to chill out

You tell em Pam!

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Originally Posted by Drug

Did any1 in Fratzia pay Elit to advocate for them? ;)

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100 $ per post.

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Originally Posted by Elldallan

But there is a perfect solution, rape hard PewPew and keep raping them until they're nothing but a speck of dust. Disregard any conflicts(real or otherwise) they enter into, eventually they'll either disband or be so small they can't possibly be a threat or influence anything. Mission Accomplished.


The difference is -75% gains.


Yes and getting hit into war is the risk you pay when you try to run, if you don't want to risk it then do some diplomacy and fork out a few acres in exchange for an extended CF, thats how things used to work and I'm pretty sure most kingdoms not holding a grudge would settle for that.

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You just stole every single answer I was about to type in response to that post.

bastard

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Originally Posted by Elit

100 $ per post.

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And there went Anris chance to pay you to quit Utopia.

We are all doomed

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Originally Posted by munk

silverfox sounds like the most sane person in here.

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If thats a fact, its a new low for the forums. Also, the ****face have been logged in more on the forums today then he has been ingame the past month.

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Originally Posted by 13nesta13

Everything you said makes a lot of sense, but not us getting an easy win. It just goes to show you havent seen the 2 KDs setup before Fratzia's hits in making it look heavily 1 sided now.

ED had 6 fatties under 110NWPA at 7-9k land, but still, those people are hard to drop due to their NW gap with our core, and even at 7k land and 40 DPA, its going to take a HUGE chunk of offense from someone on Pyro's core to tap, meaning, its going to be lower gains, and ED can easily chain our core guy if we did the tap. Not to mention they had an economic advantage with a 25k bank, and better science and WPA having remained at a larger size for longer time. It would have required loads of strategic planning on our end to win this, and we wanted to prove we could do it, or at least have a shot at trying it.

And we proceeded this war with our best efforts; Not sure what you're insinuating with this statement "Pyro helping ED run from a war to get an easy win was lame
", but to say either ED "ran" and (A) arranged to let us win (no matter how well/poorly we fought) or (B) that this win would be easy for us, is simply not accurate.

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Im curious, how often do you get to fight kds with their 6 top provs at 100 nw/acre? Cause if you concider the state ED was in to be a tough fight, boy u guys are in for a ride up there.

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Originally Posted by Shai

Im curious, how often do you get to fight kds with their 6 top provs at 100 nw/acre? Cause if you concider the state ED was in to be a tough fight, boy u guys are in for a ride up there.

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Did you see our state then? Its all relative. They had 120 mil gold to train up with, we had 40 mil or so. When we arranged the war, we had 120 NWPA and were very unpumped too. EDIT: posted the nw/land tracker on my cow but forum censored it. If you bothered enough you can just find it at ******************.
Our two "cows" (if you can even call them that) had less than 4 days to pump, and was 120 NWPA before we took up the fight.

My disclaimer before I go on to write anymore: I believe this is purely my speculation on how they prepared. Only Parth can verify.

Parth made the conscious decision to pump up the 2 big avians using the 5-6 hybrids he just doubled to optimise use of resources, simply because for 2 reasons. #1 It helps them clear their TB deficit, so that once war starts, the big cow can actually pump them at less cost/tax. #2 They feel that realistically we cant drop all 5 hybrids even if they werent pumped, since we weren't too pumped either, and also because of NW gap. In time to come, at least 2-3 of these hybrids will be pumped to a good enough state by big cow for them to take part in the action and they were willing to sacrifice 2-3 of that whole bunch of hybrids to achieve it.

The end result? The 2 big avians sat on 175+ NWPA with >73% drafted and trained, and full war build (not to mention high def, high rax, high GS and also hospitals on clerics), vs our big avians at 69% draft and half converted. I dont know how you see it, but on my end, pretty tough. You look at 115 NWPA hybrids on their end and you think we jumped in on an easy war, but did you see the 2 big avians? I am almost 100% sure if Fratzia didnt hit in, at least 2 of their 115 NWPA hybrids would be 155-165 NWPA by now, just 24h into the war. How ED chooses to expend its resources in its own war prep, we cannot interfere, but it looks like we were on the backfoot from the moment we agreed to war, considering the total resources available to them and the fact that they started their prep earlier, since they got noticed earlier.
The fact that we used our resources evenly across the KD to prepare for the war is very much my call and decision, and the same can be said about ED in theirs. When we both engaged our KD NWPA were very much close to each other.

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Originally Posted by silverfox

No, you're logic is utterly retarded

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>you're

top lel

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Originally Posted by silverfox

You had an agreement with ED that you would be CFed and if either side wanted to break it then they needed to give 48 hours notice, that is all you had. You didn't have an agreement to war, you didn't have an agreement that after notice expired then the serving KD would get to wave regardless of the others position.

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Was there any agreement forbidding action if on side went to war? The way ED conducted this was begging for trouble, if you get noticed and don't want to fight try some diplo and fork over a few acres in exchange for a CF, or as Elit has said in this thread, run 25-24h before the notice runs out, that way you have full war protection and the one who noticed has a chance to avoid training up and expending significant resources. Just going mute and running 1h before notice runs out is begging for problems because significant resources has been expended and they will want something for that effort and they'll have excellent to pretty decent gains for the next 24 hours while you have the full -75%.

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Originally Posted by silverfox

ED doesn't owe you anything other than respecting the CF for the duration which was agreed and having gave you 48 hours notice if we wanted to cancel it.

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Agreed, ED doesn't owe Fratzia anything but neither does Fratzia. War is not sacrosanct and if you cover yourself in grease and hang pieces of raw meat around your neck and thengo running around naked in the middle of a pack of rabid half-starved wolves you're gonna get bitten.

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Originally Posted by silverfox

What you're basically saying is that next time you (or any other KD) is in a war then ED can just sit and wave you, or hey maybe when you go to war then people can just notice you and once it expires then they can just start hitting into your war because otherwise it's not fair on them if they can't wave you once the notice is up.

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Most kingdoms have the sense to put in a clause saying that notice can't be given during war, but if there is no such clause then yes you can notice and start hitting into war/eowcf however much you want.