TheRock's discretion is legendary.Originally Posted by flogger
TheRock's discretion is legendary.
∙ Shadowlight ∙ A Mothers Advice ∙ Force ∙ Pansies .
Kingdom Crown Winner with Pansies, Brute Force, Sonata, Dreams
Province Crown Winner with Brute Force
∙ Brute Force ∙ Playboys ∙. Sonata ∙ Dreams ∙ Retired .
Don't look at me, I haven't spoken to the ginger all day, pretty sure he's without power
INFERNO OF ABSALOM
The Jew
You mean a kingdom that robbed both of us that we talked about GB'ing together then you pasted logs saying I wanted to GB them and you didn't follow through with it in the hopes they'd keep robbing us and not you so you could get a ceasefire so we manned up and did it while you wimped out. That one? Yeah, don't play politics.
Granted I use "you" for "absalom" in this circumstance.
Kingdoms 1/3 of your size shouldn't relentlessly rob you before every hostile, I believe that and the game involves politics. If they wanted to continue doing that to me, I would fight back in any way possible vs them. I apologized to them already, but I don't think what I did was wrong. What I apologized for was not reaching out to them on IRC before it got to that level, because once talking with them they seemed like reasonable people.
The entire top would have benefitted if your side didn't decide to play politics with the issue, don't complain when we play the politics better after you turned the issue political, especially since I'll almost always play the politics better.
In the past two ages, I've joined in on GB's to people who dealbroke abs, agreed to give abs kds acres when they get dealbroken such that no one getting dealbroken gets screwed (the abs kds wouldn't even agree to give other abs kds acres when they got dealbroken and I did) and I've given acres back to abs to people who suicided on them. I would have gladly joined in on helping you secure ceasefires with kingdoms that relentlessly rob you, and I have logs from leaders in every abs kd (including yours not less than 6 hours ago) saying they wished they joined in.
Don't paste my logs to make me look bad and instead stand up for yourself and we all profit and you don't get outplayed.
Last edited by flogger; 31-10-2012 at 04:11.
We've had 2 wars for #1 so far this age. We've lost massive stockpiles in the notice period before both. I'm sure flogger has seen it this age too and is seeing it right now like we are, as have most top kds over the past few ages. It's ridiculous people can't just let the competitive kingdoms duke it out legit without interfering. And for what, gc they don't even really need? To pay for a few extra science points in kingdoms who don't even need it? It's just stupid.
S E C R E T S
This was my and pretty much everyone's point that had ever been in the top 10 last age, and we could have communally stopped it by a show of unity. Instead it got used against me.
With Kingdoms 1/3 of our size there's little we can do to deter them other than interrupting what they find fun (their wars) in response to what we find fun (fighting top battles that require huge GC requirements). Had both sides shown they would fight back accordingly it would have stopped long ago. And what we're asking for isn't that unreasonable and in fact what most of these war kingdoms have been asking for for ages after ages from the devs, let people fight people their own size. Its not an unreasonable position.
If you want my help in deterring it in the future, and agree to help me accordingly, I'm the first one to join in and help stop it. All you have to do is ask. We team up and it stops real quickly.
Last edited by flogger; 31-10-2012 at 04:36.
I'm not sure what you're (flogger) are talking about, but I (therock) never once offered, intended or wanted to GB Cats. If you're talking about other people, go talk to them.
As far as the entire top benefiting? I disagree. I don't think what you did was right and I don't agree that it should be gangbanged for it. You and I actually did the same thing to Sonata once (to be fair, you ordered it, but I stood behind it then and I stick with it now, so I'll take equal blame). Everyone would have had an easier time pumping and prepping, sure, but Cats were reasonably indiscriminate in their robbing and never (to my knowledge) did it into hostiles and wars.
Having logs from other leaders in my kingdom is nice. Opinions are like assholes. Shockwave is of the opinion that I might not be retarded. Epiphany is of the opinion that I don't know math. Gacib is of the opinion that I'm not an asshole. None of that makes it actually true, just like one person saying they don't like Cats doesn't make that the leadership position or the position of the kingdom. That argument is asinine - by that logic, we should be waving Sanctuary or Rage.
I've handled the diplomacy with nearly every kingdom that robbed my kingdom this age. I've never asked for help, rarely made threats and never called in a gangbang. I've had deals broken 48h after they were made and remade 48h after that. I've lost acres and gold to set them up. I'm not sure what you're on about with the logs, but I do know that I'm happy with my CF list, as it stands.
I (therock) disagreed with the GB of Cats then, and even though they've given me headaches all age, I disagree with it now. I still fail to see why not liking something is grounds for a GB, just like I fail to see how robbing people is so far above and beyond some other things that have been done. If it means my kingdom can't pump as well, I'll overcome it. At least now, unlike when other kingdoms used to run around the server, it's fairly evenly distributed - I never saw kingdoms GB Fratzia, Sleepy, Whispers or kingdoms like them when they'd rob or "random" Absalom kingdoms before a fight, but then again, they generally seemed to prefer to go after Absalom kingdoms. That's not me being political. That's me accepting that I don't have a right to impose my preferred style of play on other kingdoms as long as they respect the deals we make and the fights we have.
PS: As soon as I get some power back, I'm considering unretiring.
INFERNO OF ABSALOM
The Jew
I made 2 hits into sonata, the first of which I made myself thinking the age was over with and it was just for fun since it was after the tick and I didn't know the rules, and the second of which I ordered cause I'm a troublemaker. 2 hits = GB?
This is utopia, maybe because I started playing in an era where there wasn't this "gangbanging is bad" (in there was no button and two kingdoms could simutaneously declare on another instantly for any reason) mantra I feel differently. I'm fine fighting one on one with people, but with these current rules if you are getting robbed while you're giving or receiving notice from another top kingdom, you're not fighting 1 on 1. I'm fine playing nice if others want to play nice, and I'm fine gangbanging the heck out of someone I think isn't playing nice with me.
No one ever said I talked to the rock, I qualified "you" as being absalom. You've been weird lately, so we don't talk much.
You're wrong, it happened to me at least once and there are several other dodgy situations that are generally classed as unfair/lame etc.
Fact is though, both Abs and non-Abs had spoken about how to deal with the robbing that started as soon as notices where given. Everyone agreed that equal preparation would be best for all sides. Granted, robbing prior to these notices rarely happened. Why? I've got no idea.
As soon as these notices where publicized, it suddenly started and didn't end because their excuse was "notice is not hostile" (there are plenty of posts to prove this made by them).
As said, everyone agreed something had to be done, but several said "I'll join if X joins".
Eventually all of Abs backed off and decline that they had ever participated in those chats.
That's easy to say now, after what, 2+ weeks preparation?
I never understood by what right ppl think they should be allowed to stock enormous amounts of gold and get away with it on account of having a conflict coming. Its just redicolous.
Main reason robbing from top kd?s is geting out hand are top kd?s themself. You rat on eachother when notices are given alarming warring kd?s of it and you caused lot of bad blood gb?ing cats last age. Not to mention public exposure served to show many noobish players how and where to find easy vash.
Personally I have allways stole from top kd?s and allways will, its not spite or anything ... its just that you have something I need ... lots of it. And I dont need to waste.stealth looking for it.
On the sidenote for whats it worth I prolly robbed close to 100mils this age from pulse/bio/os and not a penny from abs cause of last age actions by these kd?s and their leaders. Reading thru flogger/rock convo here I think I?ll follow same mo next age too.
Try to think a bit prot. Notice, for you people, results in amassing a lot of gc to be able to do last minute training and build convert etc. Now, the op "Rob Vaults" is dependent on the amount of gc which a target has. If there are 10 kd's in the top 10, and 1 of them suddenly starts to have a lot more gc amassed, with the same amount of thief protection, that will provide a lot more gains. Obviously a kd that has no clue of who provides silly notices to whom and continouosly sot's the different kd's will be drawn toward the gc which gives the best ratio of gains/stealth. I can understand that this looks like a correlation between notices and stealing for dumb people, but I would expect more from top kd leaders. being able to seperate root causes from symptoms is a good skill to have in life.
Now, instead of whining about how you cannot play the game the way you used to - start to device ways to adapt if you want to be successful. It's a bit sad that Cat's are used in all these examples, there should be at least one more kd on the server with some balls. If someone is robbing into this conflict it is not us, as we have CF's, so maybe there is some hope. Instead of yelling that you are unable to compete if you're not completely left alone by everyone else, try to find a way to use this to your advantages vs. your enemies. Or, if you want to change top level game play, do away with notices/CF's completely and no kd would dare to pump at 35% draft with 100 mil gc lying around. I understand the need to do it if everyone else does it, but surely your players would have more fun without it.
Silldiest
The server already imbalance with ABS dominating at the top while using each other to block for the benefits of thier alliance.
And you guys still wanna further intensify the disadvantages of The Sword for the upcoming war?
No-one complains about gold being stolen throughout the age. The complaints are gold being stolen in the socalled notice period. You think these gold stacks magically appear when notices are being given? They're already there before notice period starts. You see people rob before notice? Hardly.
The problem is people taking advantage of a notice, knowing the kingdom they rob can't afford to do anything to you because of the big, upcoming clash.
Are you on drugs? Are you telling me you believe no top kd's has recieved robs from e.g. cats except when notice is provided? We are robbing evenly across the age whenever we're out of war based on 2 parameters; 1) who has the most gc and gives us the best gains, 2) who we dislike the most and played ugly against us in the past.
Silldiest
Again, gold is already there long before a notice is given (in most cases anyway). There are hardly any ops prior to a given notice, and as soon as a notice is posted here, it starts.
All of you just act as if you have balls of steel by robbing from the big guys, but fact is all you do is rob someone who is unable to hurt you back at the time.
I did not accuse you of stealing from either of us now. Whenever I did accuse you of stealing from a hostile I was in, I had proof (which I showed you).
I prefer to fight a kingdom who is equally prepared; that is what these notices are generally for. I'd find it boring to war someone who's totally not prepared.
I think top level is fine as is, there is alot more action than there used to be. If you want to play with the big boys and prove you have balls of steel, settle yourself up there and fight with the top?
No, you're just misreading. I said hardly, which is speaking from my own experience.
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