Proposal to end he Awar

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Originally Posted by Aranfein

Well yes Palem, i quite often wave a kingdom i have nothing against, and sometimes they happen to be hostile (mistakes happen), maybe BB didnt notice the kingdom stance of war? Benefit of doubt has to be given here, as its clear BB wouldnt on purpose hit into active hostile/war, as for them breaking CF, i rather like to think they forgot they had made one...

Why would a kingdom as good as BB with early age setup vs Sages, choose to make a deal and then dealbreak on purpose when they had the upper hand?

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Neither of those points are contested Aranfein. BB did wave into war, deliberatly, and never tried to deny it. They did the cf with intent to dealbreak even though they denied it first they are now open about that it happened just like that.

the reasons for everything is ... you ****play, get oddplay ... =)

Ah why does sarcasm/joke post get taken as serious, isnt it clear to see i posted it because of all the "coincidences" being just coincidences, which has been posted numerous times.

Oh well i better try harder next time. :o

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Originally Posted by Aranfein

Ah why does sarcasm/joke post get taken as serious, isnt it clear to see i posted it because of all the "coincidences" being just coincidences, which has been posted numerous times.

Oh well i better try harder next time. :o

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Because so much stupid stuff gets posted here in full seriousity that no one can tell the the difference. Retardation has become the expected standard.

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Originally Posted by Mithras

Because so much stupid stuff gets posted here in full seriousity that no one can tell the the difference. Retardation has become the expected standard.

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It your kingdom wouldn't have posted in the thread the stupid posts would've lowered by 90%.

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Originally Posted by Aranfein

Ah why does sarcasm/joke post get taken as serious, isnt it clear to see i posted it because of all the "coincidences" being just coincidences, which has been posted numerous times.

Oh well i better try harder next time. :o

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well...I got the joke lol


Also, behave guys.

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Originally Posted by SnirpsneR

It your kingdom wouldn't have posted in the thread the stupid posts would've lowered by 90%.

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That is your biased, non constructive side talking ofc. You have painted a big picture of my kingdom as the big satan and that clouds your judgement. You will always judge against us, no matter facts or proof. If I were you I would be very upset at the persons that have brainwashed you so.

That would still be you :p
I've seen abs and know how they play. Didn't expect them to keep going with these silly posts for two weeks tho.

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Originally Posted by Mithras

Ok, so all in all we have 1 emeriti player saying that Bour should raze BB and that player also says he is not sure how he feels about it. Also we have 3 players speaking against it, one of those being the same player that says that Bour should go kill if he doesn't get his cf.

And somehow ppl interpret that into "Emeriti sent Bour". That has no basis in reality. That is just using whatever edge you can possibly get to get even at the guys you don't like.

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Just how dimwitted must you think we all are to have audacity to post that ?

They were against EMERITI waving into eowcf, not against Bours hits.
Level of arrogance shown here is simply amazing ...

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Originally Posted by Mithras

That is your biased, non constructive side talking ofc. You have painted a big picture of my kingdom as the big satan and that clouds your judgement. You will always judge against us, no matter facts or proof. If I were you I would be very upset at the persons that have brainwashed you so.

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Most people have their own opinion whatever it may be. Don't think any brainwashing has been done, if anything people are too stubborn and refuse to change their views.

There are no abs. Your big satan doesn't even exist anymore and you still can't see it

But we do have a big patience about ppl making up things about us. But two weeks of wierd lies that went so unopposed that the weaker minds actualy believed them was too much for me. So I decided to stoop to your level and show you the error of your ways.

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Originally Posted by Mithras

There are no abs. Your big satan doesn't even exist anymore and you still can't see it

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Abs is easier than Emeriti so. Plus last age u apparently were proud about being abs with the prov name change.

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Originally Posted by Mithras

That is your biased, non constructive side talking ofc. You have painted a big picture of my kingdom as the big satan and that clouds your judgement. You will always judge against us, no matter facts or proof. If I were you I would be very upset at the persons that have brainwashed you so.

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Then you should stop posting since everything that you write is biased ..

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Originally Posted by SnirpsneR

Abs is easier than Emeriti so. Plus last age u apparently were proud about being abs with the prov name change.

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Proud to have played in different abs kingdoms in our pasts, yes. Prout to be in abs now, no. Proud to be in Emeriti, yes. Emeriti was still tagged Emeriti only.

Also Rens = filthy abs scummies :D

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BB has the right to be upset that emeriti didnt openly acknowledge that they knew who BO:UR kd was.. and was hiding who BO:UR was. regarding all the emeriti willing to give BB compensation, and what BB demanded for compensation.. i dont know what was really offered/requested.. emeriti did have an edge in CF negotiations when they knew that BB was getting slowed down by bour.. i.e being able to make a longer CF

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This is what most people need to understand here. If you are looking from the outside and just see a GB or think dealbreak you need to understand and fully grasp this aspect of it. Coming from a play perspective and how everything might have broken down if there was 0 Razes into EOWCF. We have a conflict with Emeriti and BB most likely right out of that War or the fort following where clerics have a huge advantage over Sages not a CF at an extended point of time. That would mean this age would play out like most others with a possible late age war between Emeriti and BB. So please if you are posting her and seem to forget this point reference it.

BB was offered acres from Bour wich they accepted and from Emeriti to compensate. They also got the time and a cf they wanted. After this BB was asked (5 times according to flogger) if that was enough to compensate for any wrongdoings. Had they asked for more, they would have gotten more. So any argument that BB was hurt in their prep for emeriti is bogus. It was all offered compensation for. BB actively chose the dealbreak because it was more benefitial to them than a fair fight.

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Originally Posted by Leshrak

Given that our whole CF discussion to that point was predicated on one or both of us dodging simians, when someone finally SMSed me to say they were going to give you notice and wanted to make sure we hadn't agreed to a deal, I didn't think giving you notice 26h earlier than you were asking for (yr5) would have really been a big issue for you.

I confirmed our timeline with Mithras, who was the main person handling discussions around this time. Nobody made simians draft up, and in fact they had plenty of time and advance warning (a week) that we were not going to fight them at our cf expiration. We were just over half their size and fighting them at that point would have been a complete farm-out; had it gone to war, it would have been much worse than the 30k acres that we took from Chrystal or the 50k BB took from Divinity later in the age. We asked Simians for a CF extension a week in advance because of that size difference. At that time, Mithras told Anri if he wouldn't agree to CF us, we'd have to find a way to dodge the fight.

As Anri posted, he didn't think we were able to, so our request was totally denied. We gave 72h notice to Pyro (a KD 95% of our size) 26 hours before our simians duration CF was up (1 day+ before simians could even give us notice). Within 1 hour, Mithras got messages from Anri asking about whether we'd given notice to Pyro or the other way around. To claim that Simians lost "a week" of pump time and/or drafted up early is just ridiculous - at that point, they were at minimum 78h out, so they either had only JUST started drafting or hadn't even started at all when they found out that we'd given the notice.

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Its pretty funny you think your kd is so **** compared to our kd last age since you had 3x our gc and more total books (and higher wpa) then what we had, we were bigger in land because we just won a war and did a big explore right before.. 40% bigger is by the way also yeah.. just another bs number we were within declare range.

By the way the cf ran out 2 hours before our since we had a 48h notice.. .thats why we were higher drafted and also why we asked you about what you thought about the situation 24h before we even could notice and your kd was also drafting by the way.. I asked mithras why you guys were drafting and he said he was because you were preparing for us. I also asked him if he could please just tell me straight up if he would run so i didnt have to keep drafting for nothing he replied "you wont have to draft up for nothing but we would prefer that you did not notice" and also refused cf4acres because "we rather take a wave"..

And about the eoa-talks.. We could have waved BB but we agreed to cf bb(letting emertiti get nr1) on the term that we got nr1 prov and and sure if you read it absstyle you can obviously pretend like thats all fine by you that but then later claim "oh we just ment that its fine that bb let you try and get nr1 prov, but we still go for it also", but i guess thats just another reason for this whole thing.. I dont play atm but was checking the forum today and saw all the typical bstalk from the same lame people always doing it so just felt the urge to reply.

Im sorry i was so nice to you last age, we really got ****ed over by trying to have a good standing with the snakes of utopia. Our own fault ofc. I guess I forgot how you guys used to be after being away so long.

edit: by the way the log is in swedish thats why its not just ircquotes.. if anyone wanna see it they are free to.

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Originally Posted by Mithras

BB was offered acres from Bour wich they accepted and from Emeriti to compensate. They also got the time and a cf they were ok with. After this BB was asked (5 times according to flogger) if that was enough to compensate for any wrongdoings. So any argument that BB was hurt in their prep for emeriti is bogus. It was all offered compensation for. BB actively chose the dealbreak because it was more benefitial to them than a fair fight.

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It was more beneficial for Emeriti to have Bour raze BB into eowcf than a fair fight, that's what jdorje says in the log. All considerations of fair play stopped there.

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Originally Posted by TheOne

there are some claims that flogger wanted to GB emeriti for a long time (prior to this age), but those are untrue.

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The claims I've made are that flogger wanted to awar "Abs" for a long time prior to this age. This is very true and he's never made a secret of it. He has openly said this from the time he left Abs and his primary reason was that he likes fighting the best and strongest and that Abs has never been beaten in an alliance war and he wanted to be the first to beat them in one. When Abs disbanded, he again messaged me saying that he was disappointed that he wouldn't get his chance to beat them in an awar. He also didn't like dorje too much due to Sanc winning an age with dark elves after saying they were bad as flogger mentioned before.

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Originally Posted by flogger

the second prot discovered it was bourreau and i said the line "that's a holy **** abs can get ganged moment"

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The first thing that popped into floggers mind as soon as he found out that the #1 prov who was trying to get a cf with them was a former Abs player was that he can gb "abs". Yes, "abs", not Emeriti. It seems he was quite excited about this and it explains why BB wouldn't consider any reasonable resolution to this. Of course he had to pretend like he was considering resolutions both to trick Emeriti and also to maintain support from his allies so he would state he wanted something and if it was said that it wouldn't be possible then he'd show it to his allies and if Emeriti agreed to it, then he'd change it and say that's only one of the conditions he wants and add a bunch more that were unreasonable to ensure nothing could be worked out.

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Originally Posted by MyNameIsMatija

It was more beneficial for Emeriti to have Bour raze BB into eowcf than a fair fight, that's what jdorje says in the log. All considerations of fair play stopped there.

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That log was before BB was givien alot of acres and time to train on them. Afterwards BB were in better shape to fight than before since they had absorbed and trained on a significant amount of acres.

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Originally Posted by Korp

Also Rens = filthy abs scummies :D

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Die!

We did ask you something. U declined.

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Originally Posted by Mithras

That log was before BB was givien alot of acres and time to train on them. Afterwards BB were in better shape to fight than before since they had absorbed and trained on a significant amount of acres.

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You either get what I already said, or you don't. I'm not going to argue over who did what once the rulebook went down the drain.

And vir, don't make me go get logs (and yes, they are in swedish)

First off, when our first cf was made I made Anri aware of that we would not be able to fight you at that time. Anri was willing to let us have the time we asked for but you and Hesus voted him down. That was the first time I told you guys we wouldn't fight you
Second, I tried to extend our cf multiplle times but was ignored
Third, you came along and wanted me to agree on a war. I declined and once again offered to extend our cf. You then threatened to force acres for cf. I declined that offer too. I made very clear that we would not notice you, we would not fight you and we would not give you acres. This procedure was also repeated with Anri. That you think that you need to draft for us under those circumstanses is down to one thing and one thing only. You don't listen.

And lastly, we were prepping for you. We would not have noticed pyro if it it wasn't for you. And yes I said you didn't have to draft for nothing. That means it was your own choise to draft for nothing. I did my part telling you that we wouldn't notice you and that we wouldn't fight you if you noticed.

Man, if we all met in person and talked about this I bet it would be resolved so fast.

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Originally Posted by SnirpsneR

We did ask you something. U declined.

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And we have explained multiple times by now that the offers made by flogger and protector was offered to set up a dealbreak, not to agree to a sulotion.

Doubt that. I'm sure everyone would be drunk and nothing would be resolved.

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Originally Posted by tetley

Man, if we all met in person and talked about this I bet it would be resolved so fast.

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With a gangbang?

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Originally Posted by tetley

Man, if we all met in person and talked about this I bet it would be resolved so fast.

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You are probably right. Someone would say "I just wanted to GB your a**. Screw the reasons" in the first 4 minutes and the truth would be out there

Had you given up on age there would be no gb.

Well in my experience as soon as I hug it out with a person all my dislike towards them is gone.

Or yes, a massive orgy.

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Originally Posted by Mithras

Step 1: done
Step 2: done
Step 3: we have already told involved parties that we are ok with that but they demand more
Step 4: done

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You have been disingenuous in every "apology" you've given. Please review the link.

Examples of bad apologies:
We're sorry we did a bad thing but BB did a bad thing a few ages ago!
We're sorry you overreacted.
We're sorry but..... [anything]

Example of a good apology:
We're really sorry about what we've done. It was extremely wrong and it has understandably scarred our reputation in the community. We hope that with removing ourselves from the race and focusing on good moral play you will in time forgive us for what we've done. We promise it will not happen again. We will police ourselves to the standards set by the community and the play that we wish to see in it. We understand winning at all costs is costly for all and we will stand along side the community in setting a higher standard for competitive play. We throw ourselves on the community's mercy and hope to see a brighter tomorrow in Utopia.

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Originally Posted by Mithras

And vir, don't make me go get logs (and yes, they are in swedish)

First off, when our first cf was made I made Anri aware of that we would not be able to fight you at that time. Anri was willing to let us have the time we asked for but you and Hesus voted him down. That was the first time I told you guys we wouldn't fight you
Second, I tried to extend our cf multiplle times but was ignored
Third, you came along and wanted me to agree on a war. I declined and once again offered to extend our cf. You then threatened to force acres for cf. I declined that offer too. I made very clear that we would not notice you, we would not fight you and we would not give you acres. This procedure was also repeated with Anri. That you think that you need to draft for us under those circumstanses is down to one thing and one thing only. You don't listen.

And lastly, we were prepping for you. We would not have noticed pyro if it it wasn't for you. And yes I said you didn't have to draft for nothing. That means it was your own choise to draft for nothing. I did my part telling you that we wouldn't notice you and that we wouldn't fight you if you noticed.

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LOL @ the parallels between this situation and the one with Emeriti & Koalas(?) that ASF first accused Flogger of doing a bad thing first!

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Originally Posted by Mithras

And vir, don't make me go get logs (and yes, they are in swedish)


And lastly, we were prepping for you. We would not have noticed pyro if it it wasn't for you. And yes I said you didn't have to draft for nothing. That means it was your own choise to draft for nothing. I did my part telling you that we wouldn't notice you and that we wouldn't fight you if you noticed.

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So could you please explain for me then why you didnt just tell me when i asked you several times to just be clear "yes we will war pyro instead so you wont be able to notice us" or just say "we will run" i mean i would just have let the cf run on until later (which is what happened anyway) but we would have been able to have normal talks like normal people.

Dont you think saying "yeah we are prepping for you" "we rather take a wave" etc all kinda hints at you guys maybe not running? I cant even see the reason for doing it like you did except wasting some gc but instead just next time we will not give you a cf as easy as we did earlier that age, now i quit anyway so it wont matter but i dont know, keeping normal relations with people just dont suit the absers, they just have to do the shady move every time. You screwed over all our possible future talks for the gain of us drafting and converting? Not a very sustainable strat..

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Originally Posted by Band of Horses

We will police ourselves to the standards set by the community

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I lol:ed. Let the mayhem begin.

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Originally Posted by Band of Horses

You have been disingenuous in every "apology" you've given. Please review the link.

Examples of bad apologies:
We're sorry we did a bad thing but BB did a bad thing a few ages ago!
We're sorry you overreacted.
We're sorry but..... [anything]

Example of a good apology:
We're really sorry about what we've done. It was extremely wrong and it has understandably scarred our reputation in the community. We hope that with removing ourselves from the race and focusing on good moral play you will in time forgive us for what we've done. We promise it will not happen again. We will police ourselves to the standards set by the community and the play that we wish to see in it. We understand winning at all costs is costly for all and we will stand along side the community in setting a higher standard for competitive play. We throw ourselves on the community's mercy and hope to see a brighter tomorrow in Utopia.

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I'm sorry that you are not a longneck!

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Originally Posted by TheOne

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with everything being said. emeriti has the best roster out there. and have very good warring abilities with top tier leaders. they really shouldnt be that afraid if bour get farmed etc. they have enough skill/activity to take on any kingdom 1v1.. why put your kingdom in a possible 'shady' spot when you can outright own your competition 1v1? so what if bour really gets 'farmed' by BB. should have openly declared that you dont approve of bour razing into eowcf (like what Godly has mentioned)

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Which you may note IS a valid defense to a conspiracy. To bring the act to light and take actions to stop it. Emeriti did not, ergo, no defense available on this front.

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Originally Posted by Zauper

I'm sorry that you are not a longneck!

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Rofl!

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Originally Posted by Sheister

Which you may note IS a valid defense to a conspiracy. To bring the act to light and take actions to stop it. Emeriti did not, ergo, no defense available on this front.

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The defense of abandonment is available in Canada for inchoate offenses if you have a change of heart and express in a clear and timely fashion that you are withdrawing from the common purpose