Stinger vs Munk... best for my kingdom

[Loons]

Stinger >>> munk. I've never found it hard to reach stinger about suggestions/bot or web issues. If you trust your intel in the hands of an active top kingdom player you are prlly not playing in a competitive kingdom. If you want intel security stinger is the man. He is constantly adding features...I'm pretty sure most the people talking up munk haven't used stingers bot or website in a long time.

<3 u munk, but I do have to agree with this. Munk has some super nice features (the wa/slack integration and a few others) but stinger has some equally nice features. I have never had any issues with Stinger not updating, he is very responsive, and because he hosts his own bots they are super reliable. Also prolly why Munkbot has bot issues, because it is user (us being nubs issues). Its a catch 22 i guess

[KuhaN]

My old monarch uses stinger and it was nice

[Aranfein]

Stinger is really nice and easy to use, hes always around to answer questions and suggest, even added a feature for me when i asked, which turned out to be a huge help, as for Munk i gott no relations, ive only seen it a few times but never actively used it, looks good.

As the KDs i ran, was usually around the top 15, i would never trust uploading all my intel to a competitor though, simply because it seems like conflict of interest if we were to compete proper for growth, this by no means mean i suggest that i believe Munk would use intel uploaded by competitors, but because the option is there it just wouldnt be for me personally.

[Bishop]

Stinger is really nice and easy to use, hes always around to answer questions and suggest, even added a feature for me when i asked, which turned out to be a huge help, as for Munk i gott no relations, ive only seen it a few times but never actively used it, looks good.

As the KDs i ran, was usually around the top 15, i would never trust uploading all my intel to a competitor though, simply because it seems like conflict of interest if we were to compete proper for growth, this by no means mean i suggest that i believe Munk would use intel uploaded by competitors, but because the option is there it just wouldnt be for me personally.

Stinger is as much invested in top kds as munk is.

[Palem]

As the KDs i ran, was usually around the top 15, i would never trust uploading all my intel to a competitor though, simply because it seems like conflict of interest if we were to compete proper for growth, this by no means mean i suggest that i believe Munk would use intel uploaded by competitors, but because the option is there it just wouldnt be for me personally.

Does not compute.
You trust that Munk isn't look at people intel, but you don't trust him to not look at your intel....?

[Aranfein]

I dont recall Stinger playing in a top growth KD Bishop, that was what i was getting at with Munk playing for CR (i think)?

Palem, thats not what i said... I pointed out he has the option if he wants to, there is a huge different from actually looking and having the option to, reason i wouldnt go for munk is simple, I would always have at the back of my mind he would be able to, that doesnt necessarily mean he is looking.

Why try cause drama when i specifically pointed out i didnt believe he/his KD would? just that i know he has the option to...

ps. "trust" is a far fetched word in a game like utopia, especially with all the backstabbing/dealbreaks etc. going on.

[Bishop]

I dont recall Stinger playing in a top growth KD Bishop, that was what i was getting at with Munk playing for CR (i think)?

I said invested, not playing. Both have equal opportunity to use the info submitted.

[Palem]

I dont recall Stinger playing in a top growth KD Bishop, that was what i was getting at with Munk playing for CR (i think)?

Palem, thats not what i said... I pointed out he has the option if he wants to, there is a huge different from actually looking and having the option to, reason i wouldnt go for munk is simple, I would always have at the back of my mind he would be able to, that doesnt necessarily mean he is looking.

Why try cause drama when i specifically pointed out i didnt believe he/his KD would? just that i know he has the option to...

ps. "trust" is a far fetched word in a game like utopia, especially with all the backstabbing/dealbreaks etc. going on.

Your argument is illogical. The fact that Munk can access your intel isn't worrisome without the doubt that he may be looking at it, which you insist you don't think he does, which would eliminate any reason to not use munk. Stinger can access your intel just the same munk and give that intel to any interested parties if he so wanted or was enticed ($$).

I'm not trying to stir up trouble, but you're implying that you trust your intel with stinger and not munk, which I find odd.

Edit: and just to be clear, I'm under the belief that both Stinger and munk are honest people and have no reason to believe either are accessing people's intel :)

[StratOcastle]

Maybe he's implying peripheral access.

Analogy Quest:

Let's say you have nice stuff in your house and a bonded worker sees it all. Well, let's say he has no intention to steal it but he might erringly mention your goodies to his drinking buddies. Behold, drinking buddy has a day off in your neighborhood and the garage door is unlocked.

~ I know a few guys that've worked in a Columbus icons mansion and I know about the retractable dining table; for example ~

That said, I'm not the least worried about intel security. I figure people can see all they want or can proxy a good tac loaded kingdom to help with the cause. On a personal note my builds are widely criticized and summarily discarded, so scanning me is useless.

I'm currently using Stinger and it's doing it's job. I haven't been in a munkbot kingdom for 4-5 ages. If I were to offer advice to an upstart intel doctrine it'd be to use it as a tool and not a weapon of discipline.
Not everyone gets on board so quickly and some kingdoms place emphasis on silly neat freak obsessions rather than competent play. Neat freaks think competent play is filling in all the dots whereas I like to see news page performance, preferentially.

[Aranfein]

Strat0 as always nice analogy, that is exactly what i mean, temptation is an ugly bugger.

As i said Palem i am not accusing him of using intel to his advantage collected from other KDs, but the option is there, which is what i personally wouldnt like... I also know Stinger can give his intel or whatever, but the likelyhood of him using it for selfish reasons is a lot less likely seeing he does not play.

You can always be in doubt whether or not its being used to give an advantage is what im on about, that doesnt mean he is or will ever do it, but fact remains he has the option to give his kingdom a valuable advantage.

Lets say you let me borrow 100 credits course im awesome (i know small amount), but the credits are ONLY for me to use for sitting, but my KD is in desperate need of 2 players and we have no invites left... Would you let me borrow that if you know my KD will win, while you are competing too?, if we get the 2 players? or would you rather not, just incase? - You dont know me but i "seem" trustworthy... In that situation i would personally not tempt.

Palem you have your opinion, i have mine, lets just leave it at that as i dont see a reason why it should turn into a sour argument or drama.

[Palem]

As i said Palem i am not accusing him of using intel to his advantage collected from other KDs, but the option is there, which is what i personally wouldnt like... I also know Stinger can give his intel or whatever, but the likelyhood of him using it for selfish reasons is a lot less likely seeing he does not play.

You can always be in doubt whether or not its being used to give an advantage is what im on about, that doesnt mean he is or will ever do it, but fact remains he has the option to give his kingdom a valuable advantage.

One could argue that Stinger has more reason to give out intel. He's less involved in the game, so he's less invested in any "Utopian Police" stuff.

An even better, and more simple, argument can be made that both can be trusted because all it would take it one snitch and now one is ever using their tools/donating again. Whether that be a player that's retiring, or a player in the know that's switching kingdoms, that's way too big a risk.


I'm not sure what you're getting defensive about. You're not the only person who thinks that Stinger is more "trustworthy" because he doesn't play. I'm simply trying to be debunk this line of thinking because I think it's just silly.

[Band of Horses]

A big down side of using minkbot is you get updated in the TF more regularly thanks to script. This can be a big pain for those coming OOW and being in the .plunders

You can still use the TF on minknet without the bot/script too.

The argument of stinger having the same or more to gain from leaking intel is imo insane. Since he has the same to lose as mink (not getting donations or tool use) what is there for personal gain? Would mink abuse his tool (lol) to win a crown? I don't think so. But stinger can't win a crown from it so it's not a question. 0.001% is > than 0.000%

Has stinger removed any provs or kingdoms from the TF during an age? No. Has mink? Yes

imho stinger is a nicer guy and way less beggy

[Korp]

You tell em Fezzik! Munk sux

[Palem]

The argument of stinger having the same or more to gain from leaking intel is imo insane. Since he has the same to lose as mink (not getting donations or tool use) what is there for personal gain? Would mink abuse his tool (lol) to win a crown? I don't think so. But stinger can't win a crown from it so it's not a question. 0.001% is > than 0.000%

Has stinger removed any provs or kingdoms from the TF during an age? No. Has mink? Yes

The bold is wrong. Munk still has his utopia career at stake. If he screws over, say Pandas, thats 25 more people in an ever-shrinking player base that won't play with him and that's something (presumably) that munk still cares about. Stinger doesn't give a **** if utopians don't want to play with him or about his reputation (whether that's good or bad) as long as people still use stinger. The argument is that Munk has more to gain, and more to lose, which evens out.

[Tadpole]

Stinger doesn't give a **** if utopians don't want to play with him or about his reputation (whether that's good or bad) as long as people still use stinger

Who says Stinger doesn't care about his rep, or utopia for that matter? Sure, he doesn't play - but he does provide a service and puts time down. He is obviously invested in the community, why wouldn't he care what that community thinks of him? He doesn't spend time developing his tools in a vacuum where he doesn't care about his users or the game. That's just silly to think.

I've used both stinger and munk. And trust them both with my intel. But the integrity of the argument BoH and others put forward holds stronger than yours Palem. Both probably care about their rep. Both would loose users if it got out they were abusing their tools. Both could "sell" intel (if they were willing and had buyers). But only Munk would benefit on a playing level.