Pew Pew vs Debauchery aka Strippers aka Mystical Maybe

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Originally Posted by JustinSane

P.S. You and Cody really need to talk more with each other. In our talk, I made it clear to Cody that we would make sure Petrified/Pew stayed out of the conflict if you gave us the button: a promise that explicitly included pushing the button should the need arise.

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This is the second time you mentioned something about communication between the comonarchs of our kd. I will address it now, to save you the trouble of mentioning it a third time: Silva and I have read each and every log of conversations between the 4 of us (Cody Silva Jsane Mansoor). We are well aware of what everyone has said, and our posts in this thread reflect that.

What makes you so confident that you can control the actions of Pew? They started a hostile with us first, so if we choose to then start another hostile with you, Pew would be well within their rights to continue attacks on us. If Petrified couldn't get you guys to back off, then why would I believe that Jsane could get Pew to back off? In any case, we still gave you the option to war with us (read: 18.5m given option to war 15.5m) but you turned it down. You wanted us to give you relations so you could op us for an indeterminate amount of time, meanwhile Pew would continue waving:

[11:17] <Cody> or another option. its probably your least favourite. we sign a cf, you keep the acres and pump. let us fight swea. and we fight later in the age
[11:18] <Petrified> my kd wont go for a cf now, unless you enter war with swea
[11:18] <Petrified> we wont raze you into war
[11:18] <Petrified> or anything like that
[11:18] <Petrified> but in terms of this hostile we were first and as long as you are OOW we will keep hitting

kinda makes your one line about it feel a little insignificant:

[10:50] <jsane> Once you give us button they will back down, theyre just ****testing you


I feel like I am starting to repeat myself, but you don't seem to get the message.

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Originally Posted by Silvapwns

You resolved the situation because Kygal wanted to do me a favour period. Re the P.S., certainly easy to say stuff like that on hindsight after you hit into our war and gained a good chunk of acres from it without retaliation. Not the impression I got from Mansoor though so you definitely need to talk to your boss a lot more.

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Please stop the charade. You refused to acknowledge we were hostile. You made a farce out our CF negotiations. You stated clearly you would not treat us fairly. These are undeniable facts that you can't spin your way out of. Possibly ASF, but not you. Sure, you could've probably have gotten your friend to back down last 12h as to make the case that we weren't hostile at all, but the larger picture remains: you wanted to screw us over, no matter the cost.

That said, I think you need to read more carefully; my offer to Cody had nothing to do with hindsight. Contrary to your claims, we did in fact agree to war you (i.e. press button) if that was what it would take to keep Petrified at bay. Having read all the logs, you really should know that.

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Originally Posted by SillyRabbit

This is the second time you mentioned something about communication between the comonarchs of our kd. I will address it now, to save you the trouble of mentioning it a third time: Silva and I have read each and every log of conversations between the 4 of us (Cody Silva Jsane Mansoor). We are well aware of what everyone has said, and our posts in this thread reflect that.

What makes you so confident that you can control the actions of Pew? They started a hostile with us first, so if we choose to then start another hostile with you, Pew would be well within their rights to continue attacks on us. If Petrified couldn't get you guys to back off, then why would I believe that Jsane could get Pew to back off? In any case, we still gave you the option to war with us (read: 18.5m given option to war 15.5m) but you turned it down. You wanted us to give you relations so you could op us for an indeterminate amount of time, meanwhile Pew would continue waving:

[11:17] <Cody> or another option. its probably your least favourite. we sign a cf, you keep the acres and pump. let us fight swea. and we fight later in the age
[11:18] <Petrified> my kd wont go for a cf now, unless you enter war with swea
[11:18] <Petrified> we wont raze you into war
[11:18] <Petrified> or anything like that
[11:18] <Petrified> but in terms of this hostile we were first and as long as you are OOW we will keep hitting

kinda makes your one line about it feel a little insignificant:

[10:50] <jsane> Once you give us button they will back down, theyre just ****testing you


I feel like I am starting to repeat myself, but you don't seem to get the message.

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Yes, I am starting to realize now that your problem is not related to communication, but rather comprehension. Unwilling to turn this in to a debasement of either character or kingdom, however, I will not take that argument further.

While I still think Petrified was **** testing you, I must say that I find it quite amusing that you dug up that log and ignored the line that is quite possibly most central to this (particular) discussion: shortly thereafter, SWEA explicitly agreed to declare your kingdom war if that is what it would take for Petrified to back down. Lets stop the spin shall we?

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Originally Posted by JustinSane

While I still think Petrified was **** testing you, I must say that I find it quite amusing that you dug up that log and ignored the line that is quite possibly most central to this (particular) discussion: shortly thereafter, SWEA explicitly agreed to declare your kingdom war if that is what it would take for Petrified to back down. Lets stop the spin shall we?

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Again you are asking me to take all the risk. The relationship between our kingdoms is less than friendly, and I have no reason to believe you would declare just to make Pew stop waving (it would be in your own best interest to have Pew weaken us further). We would rather lose a war to Pew (albiet a 1v2 war) than give you guys the button and the war you so desperately wanted (but was too scared to wave for). It has become abundantly clear that you weren't looking for a war in the first place, because once Pew had waved you were still given that option. We would have pressed the button as soon as we got it, while your whole kd was around and available (I know this because majority of them hit into our war the hours following declare). We had no reason to delay the declare, as Pew was still going to be waving us until war. What advantage does the button even give if both kds are all online when it is pressed?

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Originally Posted by SillyRabbit

Again you are asking me to take all the risk. The relationship between our kingdoms is less than friendly, and I have no reason to believe you would declare just to make Pew stop waving (it would be in your own best interest to have Pew weaken us further). We would rather lose a war to Pew (albiet a 1v2 war) than give you guys the button and the war you so desperately wanted (but was too scared to wave for). It has become abundantly clear that you weren't looking for a war in the first place, because once Pew had waved you were still given that option. We would have pressed the button as soon as we got it, while your whole kd was around and available (I know this because majority of them hit into our war the hours following declare). We had no reason to delay the declare, as Pew was still going to be waving us until war. What advantage does the button even give if both kds are all online when it is pressed?

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I can't force you to trust us, but that was not the argument: my argument was that your claims were inaccurate, as we did, indeed, offer to press the button to ensure Petrified's disengagement. As I made clear to you, however, there was no way we would ever trust you with the button after what you did to us: for all we knew, you could've made deals with Petrified behind our back, further tilting the conflict in your favor. Why should we have risked that, given that we thought we had the upper hand? Like you, we made a bet. Sadly, again like you, we lost it. In that sense, we did indeed push to hard. After all, like earlier explained, if this is the outcome we wanted all along, we would've played things quite differently.

That said, I think both sides have made their points fairly clear by now. Given our efforts to work out the bad blood between us, I suggest we now take things off the boards. Continued spin hardly aids the diplomatic efforts from either side.

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Originally Posted by Spice

Doesnt take away the fact that SWEA did t have the balls to wave into fortified. Pewpew did, they got their war and then SWEA sees easy acres and hits into war, SWEA basically took 10-15k acres and a fair 1v1 war from pewpew. SWEA has sunk low in my opinion. Strippers was allready "punished" by abs for breaking a deal. No need to hold grudges.

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Dealbreakers were the ones who wanted to war SWEA not the other way around. SWEA preferred to cf and pump. It was crystal clear that pewpew wanted to war dealbreakers and was going to wave them and give button. Given these circumstances dealbreakers wanted to war SWEA, if they wanted to war SWEA it was on THEM to give SWEA button, not the other way around. SWEA did not really want the war, if dealbreakers want to make SWEA war against their will then they need to wave them and push for war, not call SWEA cowards and make them give button. If you want to fight someone and that kingdom doesnt want to fight you, you hit them.

Is it just me or does debauchery use retarde logic? Basically they want everything their way and everything else is obligated to cave to their detriment or they get screwed over...
1) dealbreakers want to war rage when their cf expires
2) rage may not be available for war due to being waved or them waving....debuachery dealbreaks rage before cf end to ensure conflict
3) dealbreakers want to war SWEA, SWEA doesnt want war really, dealbreakers insists SWEA gives button or SWEA pumps for nothing, wastes their gc and exits sci pump.

Basically you need to do what dealbreakers want or they will do you dirty.

Also dealbreakers were not punished by abs, they massively profited from dealbreaking and its what took them into range of kingdoms like SWEA and pew to begin with. Just an age or two ago before abs weakened, punishment would have been at the very least rage getting *all* their acres back plus compensation for time wasted due to dealbreak as opposed to dealbreakers gaining land.

Also people in dealbreakers keep claiming that they had a "war deal" with Rage. Where the hell is the evidence of such a deal. Having a Y3+48h deal is not a war deal just because dealbreakers have the goal of wanting to war Rage after cf ends...post logs and proof or stop coming up with nonsense as making up nonexistent deals doesnt justify dealbreak. Last age Rage had a legit war deal with pewpew that they got out of by resetting all of their provinces rather than warring, did we dealbreak them for it? NO.

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Originally Posted by Proteus

Dealbreakers were the ones who wanted to war SWEA not the other way around. SWEA preferred to cf and pump. It was crystal clear that pewpew wanted to war dealbreakers and was going to wave them and give button. Given these circumstances dealbreakers wanted to war SWEA, if they wanted to war SWEA it was on THEM to give SWEA button, not the other way around. SWEA did not really want the war, if dealbreakers want to make SWEA war against their will then they need to wave them and push for war, not call SWEA cowards and make them give button. If you want to fight someone and that kingdom doesnt want to fight you, you hit them.

Is it just me or does debauchery use retarde logic? Basically they want everything their way and everything else is obligated to cave to their detriment or they get screwed over...
1) dealbreakers want to war rage when their cf expires
2) rage may not be available for war due to being waved or them waving....debuachery dealbreaks rage before cf end to ensure conflict
3) dealbreakers want to war SWEA, SWEA doesnt want war really, dealbreakers insists SWEA gives button or SWEA pumps for nothing, wastes their gc and exits sci pump.

Basically you need to do what dealbreakers want or they will do you dirty.

Also dealbreakers were not punished by abs, they massively profited from dealbreaking and its what took them into range of kingdoms like SWEA and pew to begin with. Just an age or two ago before abs weakened, punishment would have been at the very least rage getting *all* their acres back plus compensation for time wasted due to dealbreak as opposed to dealbreakers gaining land.

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Yawn. Lazy to post whatsapp photos of Mansoor BEGGIN us to war them over Pewpew. Figure it out proteus, very objective view you have of the situation clearly ;) i'm sure Mansoor can confirm this...just to make your entire post look stupid ROFL. Mansoor pls do the honours buddy.

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Originally Posted by Silvapwns

Yawn. Lazy to post whatsapp photos of Mansoor BEGGIN us to war them over Pewpew. Figure it out proteus, very objective view you have of the situation clearly ;) i'm sure Mansoor can confirm this...just to make your entire post look stupid ROFL. Mansoor pls do the honours buddy.

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My view is you are a noob with no achievements that wants people to do what he wants and when they dont dealbreaks them. You should change your name from silvapwns because you don't pwn as you are terrible ingame, only thing you pwn at is dealbreaking

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Originally Posted by Proteus

My view is you are a noob with no achievements that wants people to do what he wants and when they dont dealbreaks them. You should change your name from silvapwns because you don't pwn as you are terrible ingame, only thing you pwn at is dealbreaking

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Totally. That's why I helped HoH to crown ahead of Rage last age. *waits for standard proteus comeback* leadership bla bla..yada yada yum yum..

I personally find it amusing that these dealbreaking ****heads think they deserve to be treated fairly.

Silva me and you don't compare to the likes of Proteus, once he has spoken, there is no retort. Doesn't matter than in the last 10 ages HoH averaged higher in Land rankings than Rage, or that Rage got outplayed last age when they tried to outplay HoH. Let's not forget their dealbreak with MW which happened at the very end of last age (so if we're going by, you are only punished in the age you deal broke) which means that they get no repercussions for the deal break. And yes Proteus it was a deal break...I got that from the monarch of MW, he said the deal was to give you guys 15k acres without retal and you would leave them alone for the rest of the age. Then on the last tick (before we hit..and we had made no such promise that we would not hit), you hit them 5 times, and it would have been more but for the issues of lag on the last tick.

Oh wait...Rage deal broke? What? No way....aren't deal breakers wrong and scummy and deserve to be gb'ed any chance they get? Wait...no. If it's Rage that rule doesn't apply because of some bs excuse...and if that doesn't work you can just spout some "Dude I'm Proteus" bs.

Give me a break :)

Rage only performs well when Absalom performs well. Theyre clueless to maneuver on their own without tag teams and road blocks. Giving credit where it is due, Rage knows how to pump, and given enough time, they can be quite deadly. But let's not pretend Rage has anymore skills beyond that.

labelled dealbreakers after one deal break?
Then what should you name Rage with multiple dealbreaks through their history?

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Originally Posted by alan03

labelled dealbreakers after one deal break?
Then what should you name Rage with multiple dealbreaks through their history?

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Rage of Absalom? Duh.

lol ZING

i honestly dont get all the forum talks about strippers.. they were open game in the ghetto, they were open game between warring kds, they are still open game for top kds.. i seriously doubt sanity of any person who would take them seriously & consider them to be treated as an honorable kd.. you basically create your own reputation & cant run away from it, no matter how many times you change your name or what tier do you play - because its your own character, bringing the problems.. please, just stop all these forum spamming as if they were a kd worth mentioning..

Beat rage , beat HOH b2b. took on pew pew right after. Pretty damn good kd if u ask me. Need more kds like this that don't just nap a cf all age but actually have the balls to war and wave and pull dirty moves. Like how it was back when bf was at its peak. Never knowing when u were going to get hit or waved so always having to be ready. None of this bs sitting on 40 draft all age sci pumping away.

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Originally Posted by Smitty87

Beat rage , beat HOH b2b. took on pew pew right after. Pretty damn good kd if u ask me. Need more kds like this that don't just nap a cf all age but actually have the balls to war and wave and pull dirty moves. Like how it was back when bf was at its peak. Never knowing when u were going to get hit or waved so always having to be ready. None of this bs sitting on 40 draft all age sci pumping away.

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pulling dirty moves doesnt make you 'pretty damn good kd', just fyi..

Well as Godly said in another thread. You focus on your best target and deal with it in the best possible way. So if that means NAPs, blocks and pump for Absalom then why not accept that it is the opposite for kds outside that environment :).

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Originally Posted by LoRD_SaMPuaN

pulling dirty moves doesnt make you 'pretty damn good kd', just fyi..

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Not by itself, but I'm pretty sure he meant the general idea of playing aggressively, warring and winning said wars and using those war wins to advance to the top instead of what appears to be the usual status quo. I don't agree with everything the Dealbreakers have done, but I do kind of respect them a little more for that. Even though it's apparently not how most of the top 10 does things, it's a lot more challenging to win wars with sizeable opponents than to cease-fire almost everyone who's a threat and farm ghettos and science pump to climb the ranks.

Farore- great minds think alike. I think What strippers have dOne is great for the game ad hope a lot of other kds follow suite. 2-3 kds like them in the top 10 and watch the dynamics of the "leet" kds change. No more age long cf's , no more 10 weeks of whoring every kd will have to earn their acres. It's bs a kd can raise an 18k bank in opposed because any kd that can prevent it is cf'd..

I don't see how their behaviour is of such a great significance. They seem to be going into the "top 10 land farm" way.

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Originally Posted by Farore

Not by itself, but I'm pretty sure he meant the general idea of playing aggressively, warring and winning said wars and using those war wins to advance to the top instead of what appears to be the usual status quo. I don't agree with everything the Dealbreakers have done, but I do kind of respect them a little more for that. Even though it's apparently not how most of the top 10 does things, it's a lot more challenging to win wars with sizeable opponents than to cease-fire almost everyone who's a threat and farm ghettos and science pump to climb the ranks.

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they chose themselves to play by the rules of the top by agreeing to cf deals etc., they also chose to break their word themselves.. winning wars via backstabbing is not more challanging than beating any moderate warring kd or respectable by any bit..

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Originally Posted by alan03

labelled dealbreakers after one deal break?
Then what should you name Rage with multiple dealbreaks through their history?

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Name them. I haven't played at all since a few days before the end of last age but I see talk here by ex-hoh players claiming Rage deal broke MW but I haven't seen that talk from MW. If it was a dealbreak (which I haven't seen MW claim) then it'd be the first one I can recall. Nice try though by self proclaimed "**** stirrers" like jamin to deflect from his kingdom's dealbreaking by trying to attack Rage.

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Originally Posted by Realest

Rage only performs well when Absalom performs well. Theyre clueless to maneuver on their own without tag teams and road blocks. Giving credit where it is due, Rage knows how to pump, and given enough time, they can be quite deadly. But let's not pretend Rage has anymore skills beyond that.

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Rage has performed "well" essentially every single age since their creation many years ago. That is much harder than making a kingdom with a "one age only, win at any cost and by any methods" mantra that only lasted 2 ages.

Rage has been top 10 every single age they have existed. Prior to this age, only Coss had ever beat them in a war despite Rage having fought a LOT of wars. They've had many wars where they were caught early unprepared and at significant disadvantage by other top kingdoms and Rage still won the wars, often in dominating fashion. They've honor crowned, won several "combined crowns" when that was a somewhat interesting external ranking, and even been in the lead for a war win crown 3/4 of the way through an age. They've been gangbanged and 2v1'd many times resulting in serial defeat of the offending kingdoms in back to back (to back to back to back) wars.

Yes, when other alliances have dominated and systematically knocked Absalom kingdoms out of the top, Rage could have cut selfish deals to gain NAPS at the expense of allies to rank better, but never did so and was therefore on occasion beat down to the lower top 10. This is nothing to be ashamed of.

Rage has played with the goal of being the strongest kingdom on the server even above "going for crowns" and typically during the numerous times when we narrowly missed out on a crown, we could have beat the crowning kingdom in a fight. This isn't meant as an excuse for any lacking in crowns and no other kingdom has outperformed Rage in crowns or average rank during the full time frame Rage has been around.

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Originally Posted by LoRD_SaMPuaN

i honestly dont get all the forum talks about strippers.. they were open game in the ghetto, they were open game between warring kds, they are still open game for top kds.. i seriously doubt sanity of any person who would take them seriously & consider them to be treated as an honorable kd.. you basically create your own reputation & cant run away from it, no matter how many times you change your name or what tier do you play - because its your own character, bringing the problems.. please, just stop all these forum spamming as if they were a kd worth mentioning..

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like it or not we are the most talked about kd in the server, as much as we hate that. just gotta deal with it mate.

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Originally Posted by Smitty87

None of this bs sitting on 40 draft all age sci pumping away.

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40% draft is too high to be pumping science :p

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Originally Posted by LoRD_SaMPuaN

they chose themselves to play by the rules of the top by agreeing to cf deals etc., they also chose to break their word themselves.. winning wars via backstabbing is not more challanging than beating any moderate warring kd or respectable by any bit..

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Because everyone knows that as long as you start a war off by breaking a deal, you don't need war strategy, active players or coordination of attacks, thievery and magic to maximize your kingdom's gains and win said conflict. You're right, those types of wars must be much easier. ^.^

Even if they got an initial advantage by deal breaking, it's not like they can just kick back till minimum time is up and win a war. To clarify, I was not trying to say that a "dealbreaking war" is more challenging than a "nondealbreaking war", but that it's more challenging than the ghetto farm/cease fire/science pump trend. For that matter, I think an argument could be made that the Dealbreakers have the most challenging age of play of any top kingdom now, since everyone is gunning for them. It will take some hard work to stay in the top now and I would find it interesting if they can pull it off.

Big fan of your analysis in general Farore, in all threads, this included :)

You are a girl aren't u?

Thanks for making this age interesting strippers/debauchery.

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Originally Posted by brickwolfman

40% draft is too high to be pumping science :p

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Wrong i am 52% drafted and i make Rushed sci...

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Originally Posted by calle

Wrong i am 52% drafted and i make Rushed sci...

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rushed is not extreme?

With 50% draft and a halfway competent pump build extreme science is mostly covered... it's like 10 gc/acre per tick to bump up to extreme, not exactly difficult to find.

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Originally Posted by goodz

rushed is not extreme?

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spot on :)

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Originally Posted by idiocy

With 50% draft and a halfway competent pump build extreme science is mostly covered... it's like 10 gc/acre per tick to bump up to extreme, not exactly difficult to find.

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where does the gold come from needed to also fund dragons at 50% draft?

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Originally Posted by tr3ndy

Thanks for making this age interesting strippers/debauchery.

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<3 pleasure. Been great for us so far as well, we ballin'.

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Originally Posted by AquaSeaFoam

Prior to this age, only Coss had ever beat them in a war despite Rage having fought a LOT of wars.

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Rage of Absalom: spitting on Feyr's resume since age 50.

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Originally Posted by brickwolfman

spot on :)


where does the gold come from needed to also fund dragons at 50% draft?

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Consodering people come out of war cfs with 1000 gc/acre, not too hard to find a way.

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Originally Posted by Silvapwns

Big fan of your analysis in general Farore, in all threads, this included :)

You are a girl aren't u?

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Thanks for the compliment ^.^ And I don't see how it's relevant, but yes.

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Originally Posted by Farore

Thanks for the compliment ^.^ And I don't see how it's relevant, but yes.

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This would be because I normally only pay compliments to the ladies ;)

We had 4 ladies in the KD before this...unfortunately only one remains...would you like to be a stripper? We have more chapters of the fan-fiction hidden in the kd!

As tempting as the fan fiction offer is, I'm happy with my current kingdom ^.^ Although your kingdom definitely is one of the most interesting on the server. Maybe one day. Thank you for the invite ^.^

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Originally Posted by Soul_Hunter

I don't see how their behaviour is of such a great significance. They seem to be going into the "top 10 land farm" way.

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So was AMA after your double hostile and yours wasn't as bad.
...just sayin

In terms of game play, I don't think Debauchery has done a bad job at all at playing the game. Beat Rage in war. Beat HoH. Who knows if they would have beat PewPew if they hadn't gotten doubled by SWEA. They've certainly done better than I would have EVER given them credit for coming into the age if I had known they would be growth based this age.