Quote Originally Posted by Mordrek View Post
As a complete "has-been" and someone who would probably be seen as a n00b by a larger part of the top players if they knew me... TheRock, are you out of your mind?

First and foremost, the conflict between my kd and Mercy wouldn't have degraded into war earlier if there had been a different declare range. I know that you know the game mechanics fairly well since you brag about it in this thread. Given that, you still decided to wave a pumped orc kd about the size of your bulk while you also had a huge cow who inflated your kd nw. Hence, you had the benefit of a cow while we had the benefit of relative nw gains. Your choice and it's more or less a fair deal. You also knew that we would have to hit Mercy down a lot before being able to declare, hence your decision to wave could look more like you hoping that we would give you a free wave because your cow was so large and frightening. However, your objectives with the wave is not important since the result, us finally declaring, wouldn't have arrived earlier had the nw ranges been different. We in Monument had some pre-war goals which included taking down your faes as well as taking control of your bank and the war was declared as soon as our pre-war objectives was reached since we had stripped you of enough nw at that time to declare.

Now, since your wave and our retals have been used by you as a standard for top kingdom mechanics gone wrong then sure - Mercy having a huge bank forced us to make half of our declaration wave as a normal wave because you were out of range but that's about it. However, whining about KDRN gains is just stupid. Why? Because you knew about it and still decided to run a cow hence inflating your kd nw and making it more profitable for other kds to hit your bulk than it is for them to retaliate. There is no hidden mechanics, no unknown factors or nothing except different decisions on a kd wide level and your kingdom decided upon the bank even though the bank also resulted in the other provinces being more vulnerable.

It does sound like you're angry because the current mechanics doesn't allow you to eat the cake and still have it for later. A cow grants your kingdom huge benefits, just look how you aided some of your provinces during the war, but any good game brings counter-play and your bank brings some disadvantages that others can use and abuse. It's called adaptation and is a trademark for good players so just please leave the Mercy vs Monuments conflict out of this discussion and treat Sheister like the good player he is.

That is, unless you want to admit that top kingdom mechanics is different from any other mechanics, and that any disadvantage to the current preferred strategies is illegitimate since it can be used and abused to harm the big egos that inhabit this thread.
I've known your monarch for a long time, we had a pretty open dialogue the entire war. You're completely incorrect about the free wave - we wanted a war and expected you to give one. Logs are being included to give some more evidence, although half were lost to Mibbit.
[11:01] <therock> who is it?
[11:02] <maximouse> hawk is a huge noob for not telling you
[11:02] <maximouse> did you not ask around in abs council?
[11:03] <therock> oh it's you?
[11:03] <therock> LOL
[11:03] <therock> nobody knew
[11:03] <maximouse> hehe:)
[11:03] <therock> so we waved
...
[11:13] <therock> if you're up for a war, should be fun
...
[11:20] <maximouse> 1 serious question though
[11:20] <maximouse> why wave a KD out of dragonrange?
[11:20] <maximouse> negates the biggest advantage you have with a bank
[11:20] <therock> biggest kd in range we could wave
[11:21] <maximouse> you NAP too much:P
[11:21] <maximouse> I was kinda expecting you guys would wait till we were in dragonrange
[11:22] <maximouse> use the bank to spit out dragons at a crazy rate
[11:23] <therock> nah, we had hostiles
[11:35] <maximouse> btw, why the half assed wave? Did you think we would be stupid enough to hand you the button>
[11:38] <therock> uh
[11:39] <therock> cuz we're awesome!
[11:39] <therock> :D
[11:39] <maximouse> lol

You guys set three separate declare dates, and then on the third one, were forced to spend half a wave max gaining just to get us into range (per Maximouse). I'm sure you had pre-war goals, but you also got screwed around by the declare range. Given this, I disagree with your first paragraph - it would have gone to war earlier, since you would have used your earlier declare date. It wouldn't have been an instant declare, but it would have been earlier.
[I lost the logs from Maximouse where he mentioned the three declare dates, here are some other fun ones.]
[22:04] <therock> war time!
[22:04] <maximouse> it is?
[22:04] <therock> yeah
[22:04] <therock> we are ready
[22:04] <therock> you can push button now
[22:04] <maximouse> lol
[22:06] <maximouse> drop 11K NW please
[22:06] <therock> why?
[22:06] <maximouse> declare range:P
[22:06] <maximouse> new feature this age
[22:06] <therock> wtf
[22:06] <therock> you got yourselves hit out of nw range?
[22:06] <maximouse> you can declare 33% upwards and 25% downwards
[22:07] <maximouse> we were at 22% your size to begin with
[22:07] <therock> gayyyyyyyyyy
[22:07] <maximouse> orcs drop harder in NW then your dwarves
[22:07] <therock> odd
[22:07] <therock> it's almost like we ran 20% hosps ON PURPOSE
[22:07] <maximouse> if you wait long enough though we will declare
...
[17:53] <maximouse> seriously, stop gaining NW:P
[17:53] <maximouse> how can we declare you if you keep getting out of range:P

My wave and retals were actually not used as a standard. I'm not sure where you got that idea - I never really mentioned my kingdom in this thread, except in hypotheticals. Given this, I disagree with your second paragraph. When asked for examples, I've given the same three throughout this thread: Sanctuary vs Snakes, HOH vs Psych Ward, Rage vs Insolence. Mercy is not mentioned.

I'm actually not angry about our war, or even angry in general. I've actually left the Mercy vs Monument conflict out of this entire discussion. I'm not sure why you think I'd be mad about it, it was a fun war. I ignore Sheister because he does not respond to statements or take the time to read things that were written. I'm more than happy to engage almost anyone in a conversation, but a dialogue is a two way street. I don't see any need to spend time repeating my points to people who refuse to read them.

As opposed to me, who takes the time to read your post and then respond to each point with concise, fact-based analysis.