AMA vs sanct round 2

[guard14n]

How is it embracing myself to merely mention something that happened. If one kd fights another and gains land from them in that fight, is saying "We gained X land embracing yourself? Just because AMA beat Sanc does not mean they would beat Havoc those two things are not correlated. Half of the reason for sanc losing was not knowing about the lack of the fort tpa penalty - Havoc knew about that from watching what happened to sanc and would not fall prey to the same move.

Keep telling urself that :)

[shakenbridge]

I consider beating you in Age 51, there is no way you can really argue otherwise. You got the drop on us this age after war, we did not have time to train up properly to have a good fight so you got a wave for it.

In Age 51 you were the one who noticed and both sides had ample time to train, there was prolonged exchange of hits and Rage took a lot of acres from both kingdoms in spite of 1v2, inspite of FW, etc so if you dont think I can consider proving as we were better than you that age you have some issues.



How is it embracing myself to merely mention something that happened. If one kd fights another and gains land from them in that fight, is saying "We gained X land embracing yourself? Just because AMA beat Sanc does not mean they would beat Havoc those two things are not correlated. Half of the reason for sanc losing was not knowing about the lack of the fort tpa penalty - Havoc knew about that from watching what happened to sanc and would not fall prey to the same move.

I think he may have meant "embarrassing" yourself.

DHaran has a point, though - why do you keep bringing up Age 51? I fail to see what that has to do with the current situation.

[Elit]

I consider beating you in Age 51, there is no way you can really argue otherwise. You got the drop on us this age after war, we did not have to train up properly to have a good fight so you got a wave for it.

In Age 51 you were the one who noticed and both sides had ample time to train, there was prolonged exchange of hits and Rage took a lot of acres from both kingdoms in spite of 1v2, inspite of FW, etc so if you dont think I can consider proving as we were better than you that age you have some issues.

Age 50 when Dreams was after land chart from begin Rage didunt made any competition to us, ever after GB you loss bad.
Age 51 Dreams was after honor chart. 1/2 from age we was x2-3 land size smaller from Rage. Do you need to explain how work sci points. You had less wars from us and much free pump time. Do you think there is way to beat in gains 30-35% war vs 7-8%. Talk you won because had gains in hostile is pathetic.

This conflict has proven that Elit is nowhere near invincible.. he is really gettin buttraped by Havoc and Sanctuary. Props to those two kingdoms for a game well played, they are really dominating this match up, I'd say.

Its ok, Storm is coming...

[Proteus]

Age 50 when Dreams was after land chart from begin Rage didunt made any competition to us, ever after GB you loss bad.
Age 51 Dreams was after honor chart. 1/2 from age we was x2-3 land size smaller from Rage. Do you need to explain how work sci points. You had less wars from us and much free pump time. Do you think there is way to beat in gains 30-35% war vs 7-8%. Talk you won because had gains in hostile is pathetic.

If you know someone will beat you why do you grow into their range? Why do you bother to notice them? And most of all why do you bother to talk **** on the forums after giving notice. You did all of those things. I will tell you why. Its because your kingdom has big ego, and you think that merely "showing up" is enough for you to win. You did not have science because you had a big ego and thought you would be able to tripple crown. You thought that you could afford to spend half the age getting honor and then growing up into range of kds who have been big all age pumping science and still be able to beat them due to ego.

Its not my fault we had science and you did not, I executed our plan well. Whoever was the big ego who did your strat that age made serious errors in first thinking you would even have a remote chance to tripple crown, second to grow into range of kds that will farm you out (you should have stayed small), and thirdly to notice us. You did all of those things willingly, no one made you do it and in the end you lost. Because you did not play good but someone else did does not mean that the people who played well do not get credit for the win. It just means you did not play good and lost to someone who did. Again your fault, not theirs.

[Korp]

If you know someone will beat you why do you grow into their range? Why do you bother to notice them? And most of all why do you bother to talk **** on the forums after giving notice.

If you know you can beat someone why do you give them a eoa CF? Seems rather stupid doesnt it.

You thought that you could afford to spend half the age getting honor and then growing up into range of kds who have been big all age pumping science and still be able to beat them due to ego.

You talk about the kingdom that even after getting gangbanged by you and your fellow absalomites crowned, that tells how crappy you are. Consider that kingdom was put toghter in 30 minutes.

But its nice that Proteus only can bring up things that happend over a year ago, but I guess somebody that hasnt crowned since then has not much to brag about either way ;)

[Elit]

If you know someone will beat you why do you grow into their range? Why do you bother to notice them? And most of all why do you bother to talk **** on the forums after giving notice. You did all of those things. I will tell you why. Its because your kingdom has big ego, and you think that merely "showing up" is enough for you to win. You did not have science because you had a big ego and thought you would be able to tripple crown. You thought that you could afford to spend half the age getting honor and then growing up into range of kds who have been big all age pumping science and still be able to beat them due to ego.

Its not my fault we had science and you did not, I executed our plan well. Whoever was the big ego who did your strat that age made serious errors in first thinking you would even have a remote chance to tripple crown, second to grow into range of kds that will farm you out (you should have stayed small), and thirdly to notice us. You did all of those things willingly, no one made you do it and in the end you lost. Because you did not play good but someone else did does not mean that the people who played well do not get credit for the win. It just means you did not play good and lost to someone who did. Again your fault, not theirs.

Don't see reason why we cant grow if we have ability for it. From top 100 land chart kd we become competitor for n1 land chart. I don't think its bad play.

[Proteus]

Don't see reason why we cant grow if we have ability for it. From top 100 land chart kd we become competitor for n1 land chart. I don't think its bad play.

Fair thing to do would be to admit you lost fight and lost good amount of acres and not make excuses about it. If you did not try to deny it or make excuses no one would even say anything.

[PhoenixScorpion]

As if anyone is saying his notice wasn't legitimate. The double hostile is the issue.

Can you read or are you just stupid? Here is his exact quote:

Tell that to goodz who accepted that clause when he negotiated a CF. Please.

Obviously he is referring to the clause in their notice saying it is invalid. Shoo fly...

You were not involved yet you tell others "you have no idea". Terrible logic.

So because I was not involved with the CF negotiations I have no idea? Sounds legit. Also has zero to do with what I was talking to Avalanche be gone n00b.

You use the word logic in conjunction with quoting PhoenixScorpion. You're terrible prot, just... terrible :)

This coming from someone who had to get Simians to double us because we noticed you and you tried to do the same thing as AMA. Your pathetic. Seems you and your allies MO to run from us. Using you name in conjunction with either logic or skill is just laughable.

Well, he did praise elit's setup, so that pretty much solidifies the "you have no idea" notion. Don't you remember what happened when I wanted to run UD cleric in ZZ? When UD was way stronger than they are now? lulz

Dont burst his bubble.

Mate i agree with u i just dont like the concept of ABS. Its ok to have friends but in this game its not a solution to create another abs. The solution is that every kd has to compete with everyone while getting different allies every age to achieve their goals. The core of the alliances part is broken leaving other kds on the scrubbed side of the coin. Mehul once said that this game is made to make people meet other people and compete with eachother. Thats why u couldnt buy a place in ur kd like it is now. The whole idea of utopia is to create a team of NO MORE than 25 people and reach ur goals.

You speak about Mehul yet obviously never played when he ran the game. Perhaps go and look what his opinion was on alliances. There are a part of the game and impossible to remove. Best you can do is make the protections from multi-engaging entities non-beneficial as much as possible while also not making them abusable.

As I remember those events Elit didn't doublehostile Rage, Elit had legitimate conflict with Rage and BIO decided to go **** **** up for Rage because they had done something to BIO earlier that war. Elit then refused to halt hostilities with Rage because after all he wasn't the one who was interfering and couldn't let Rage take BIO to war and beat them. So Elit is not the one to blame there, BIO is but yes it was completely lame of BIO to interfere in that conflict.


You are correct of course, this isn't even remotely the most dirty stuff that's happened over the ages.
But it's still dirty and it's clear that Abs planned this all along, they knew Sanct's actions would elicit a response(if there hadn't been a 0 thief prov they would simply have done something else)
Sure it was incredibly stupid to have a 0 thief prov but anyone who thinks there won't be a reaction when the ally of someone just sending notice robs that prov is clearly not living in this world.

Except that they are. It was obvious Elit would stomp Havoc completely considering what they had just done to Sanct despite Sanct having the superior war setup in Abs.

Thats folly at best and a complete double standard. If that is the case then ABS should have "responded" to one of our KD's getting target-shared on the forums, and would also easily justify even worse action against AMA. AMA had to think that target-sharing, trying to use a Hostile Block, etc would elicit some response according to that logic correct? Anyone who thinks their wont be some kind of negative diplomatic and strategic price to target-sharing, Hostile Blocking a KD after getting notice, etc wont get a reaction is clearly not living in this world called REALITY...

If Elit was so sure he would stomp Havoc, or even Rage for that matter, why did he wave a KD for stealing that he cant war to dodge the notice of one until he could farm alot more acres and explore up and ask for an EOA CF from other. I love when n00bs say Sanctuary had the best war setup in Absalom when actually they had the one most geared for whoring. Priceless...

You do know that it kinda never has been this way in the whole history of utopia...there always have been alliances alot even back in the days.
So there was a form in balance of that...Some fought abs some where create especially against abs and they didnt last...So its abs fault too still have the endurance to be around until this day?

I have been in Echo and Spirit wich was merely a collaberation between other top kd's too make a fist vs ABS...wich went well for awhile but they didnt last for that long for many reasons.

I remember crushing ECHO/Spirit for trying to AWAR Absalom. Mind you at the time I was not even in Absalom but PROPHECY/Legacy. But Absalom has always been some of the most fair-playing and honorable KD's versus those who just wish to powerplay KD's because they suck lol.

Heh naah i just dont like abs :D Not the players (xpt may be ASF i dont like him :D) but the concept. As for the alliance part yes temorary is ok. And there was an interview few years bach with mehul - there he sais what the original concept of the game is. As far for the game - make some research: how many people we used to have 10 years ago, 5 years, 3 years, 2 years, 1 year ago and now? U can make a graph to see it better - back in during mehul there were tens of thousands of players and if my memory is right i recall i point we almost reached 100k. Now we are below 7k and huge part of those players are inactive or mults. There are a lot of factors to be this way but one of that factors is that ally system. This is a game of competition and as long as there is someone with this kind of an advantage it will always make some people quit. Thats the reason i dont like abs :D Cheers

Yeah I'm sure that the mismanagement of Utopia by those who have run it since Swirve, the advance of computing technology (graphics, MMORPG, etc), etc has had 0 to do with the decline in players. LMAO.

Of course they aren't saints, but Abs always tries to act like the better men yet find excuses to double hostile people.

We never claimed to be saints. Just better and carrying bigger sticks lol.

Here's the problem ASF, regardless of all the other facts MA and Sanc were hostile with each other and Havoc waved in. That's a powerplay no matter how you want to try to dice it up.

Did Elit do stupid things? Yes
Did Abs do some scummy things? Yes


The thing I find particularly distressing is that while you 3 kds claim to be in an alliance, you can't seem to control each other. Sanctuary knew Havoc was next in line to take on MA. Let's ignore the stealing for a second and just focus on the hits. If MA waves into Sanc and Havoc waves MA, there's absolutely no issue. MA tried to dodge and failed.

So you have Sanc ignoring Havoc's situation and Havoc ignoring Sanc's hostile. The only reasonable explaination is that Sanc was stalling for Havoc to pump another bank up and then found themselves in a situation they couldn't get out of without things getting messy, which doesn't make Abs look any better.

Being in alliance with other KD's dont mean you dictate their actions. Means you work together to ensure the best outcome for all. Sanctuary stole from MA just like MA targetshared Havoc (stealing isnt doubling or a "Hostile" action this is confirmed by Elit, Cats, and others), and also considering MA had got notice from Havoc before the stealing and was technically already Hostile, MA chose to be stupid and not negotiate CF with Sanc while also allowing Sanc to hit them for acres and not lose only GC but also troops and land. Sounds smart. We ignore others situations because we are independent KD's and being allied is secondary to making our own decisions about how to handle situations. Thats how real partnerships and friendships work, one based of the other persons ability to make decisions for themselves.

If Sanct had not decided to go and piss MA off I would have agreed with you that MA didn't have any legitimate reason to avoid Havoc but when an alliance mate decides to interfere with their preparation that is clearly NOT 1v1 and MA can be expected to respond to that provocation, this is not dodging, Sanct initiated a legitimate conflict with MA when they stole from them regardless of how much smaller sanct was, any move by Havoc other than reinstating the original notice is not 1v1 and a blatant attempt by Abs to bully MA because you know that Havoc could not possibly hope to beat MA 1v1, Rage might have been able to do it late age when they're whored their sage bonus properly but no other Abs kd obviously has a chance in a fair fight.

Sanct went after MA again and MA responded as anyone could have predicted they would so MA and Sanct trades hits, dragons and ops for 48h and then both sides stops attacks for a mere 12 hours(but not ops) because Sancts notice with pewpew is running out and MA's notice with Havoc is running out, this does not magically mean it's not a hostile any more as you amongst others have claimed before when you say that hostile is defined by the prescence of a button or the word hostile on target kd's kd page. So by ANY sane definition MA and Sanct was still in a hostile and Havoc and pewpew decided to intervene, Sanct brought that upon themselves when they antagonized MA despite knowing pewpew was coming so maybe it was Sanct trying to run from pewpew and not MA running from HAvoc like you're trying to claim and failing.

There is no evidence or indication that MA was running from Havoc, Sanct antagonized MA and should have expected a result. This could be interpreted as Sanct running from pewpew but thats unlikely since MA would hand Sancts ass to them in a way pewpew could never have don(no insult intended to pewpew). Mor likely is that Havoc knows they can't possibly hope to win against MA in a fair 1v1 fight, after all MA just handily beat Sanct without barely breaking a sweat and Sanct had by far the best war setup so the result of a fair Havoc vs MA war was already a given.

Dude you really need to pick a position and stick with it. Earlier (above in my same reply) you state that no Absalom KD could beat MA 1 vs 1. Then you say maybe Rage after we whore Sage? Then again at end of post you again say Sanc had by far best war setup? What makes you think that and what do you know about any of our setups or are you just repeating something someone told you because you liked the sounds of it and actually have no idea how mechanics work or wtf ur talking about? Also stealing is not a Hostile, and given that MA target-shared Sanc ally, so what if Sanc steals from them during a notice period. Get real. I love how you say Sanc had it coming because they got noticed by Pew Pew, yet MA didnt when they had even more advanced notice.

[DHaran]

Fair thing to do would be to admit you lost fight and lost good amount of acres and not make excuses about it. If you did not try to deny it or make excuses no one would even say anything.

And the fair thing for Abs to do would be to admit to shady play and double hostiling AMA to keep them from crowning and not make excuses about it.

[guard14n]

Can you read or are you just stupid? Here is his exact quote:



Obviously he is referring to the clause in their notice saying it is invalid. Shoo fly...



So because I was not involved with the CF negotiations I have no idea? Sounds legit. Also has zero to do with what I was talking to Avalanche be gone n00b.



This coming from someone who had to get Simians to double us because we noticed you and you tried to do the same thing as AMA. Your pathetic. Seems you and your allies MO to run from us. Using you name in conjunction with either logic or skill is just laughable.



Dont burst his bubble.



You speak about Mehul yet obviously never played when he ran the game. Perhaps go and look what his opinion was on alliances. There are a part of the game and impossible to remove. Best you can do is make the protections from multi-engaging entities non-beneficial as much as possible while also not making them abusable.



Thats folly at best and a complete double standard. If that is the case then ABS should have "responded" to one of our KD's getting target-shared on the forums, and would also easily justify even worse action against AMA. AMA had to think that target-sharing, trying to use a Hostile Block, etc would elicit some response according to that logic correct? Anyone who thinks their wont be some kind of negative diplomatic and strategic price to target-sharing, Hostile Blocking a KD after getting notice, etc wont get a reaction is clearly not living in this world called REALITY...

If Elit was so sure he would stomp Havoc, or even Rage for that matter, why did he wave a KD for stealing that he cant war to dodge the notice of one until he could farm alot more acres and explore up and ask for an EOA CF from other. I love when n00bs say Sanctuary had the best war setup in Absalom when actually they had the one most geared for whoring. Priceless...



I remember crushing ECHO/Spirit for trying to AWAR Absalom. Mind you at the time I was not even in Absalom but PROPHECY/Legacy. But Absalom has always been some of the most fair-playing and honorable KD's versus those who just wish to powerplay KD's because they suck lol.



Yeah I'm sure that the mismanagement of Utopia by those who have run it since Swirve, the advance of computing technology (graphics, MMORPG, etc), etc has had 0 to do with the decline in players. LMAO.



We never claimed to be saints. Just better and carrying bigger sticks lol.



Being in alliance with other KD's dont mean you dictate their actions. Means you work together to ensure the best outcome for all. Sanctuary stole from MA just like MA targetshared Havoc (stealing isnt doubling or a "Hostile" action this is confirmed by Elit, Cats, and others), and also considering MA had got notice from Havoc before the stealing and was technically already Hostile, MA chose to be stupid and not negotiate CF with Sanc while also allowing Sanc to hit them for acres and not lose only GC but also troops and land. Sounds smart. We ignore others situations because we are independent KD's and being allied is secondary to making our own decisions about how to handle situations. Thats how real partnerships and friendships work, one based of the other persons ability to make decisions for themselves.



Dude you really need to pick a position and stick with it. Earlier (above in my same reply) you state that no Absalom KD could beat MA 1 vs 1. Then you say maybe Rage after we whore Sage? Then again at end of post you again say Sanc had by far best war setup? What makes you think that and what do you know about any of our setups or are you just repeating something someone told you because you liked the sounds of it and actually have no idea how mechanics work or wtf ur talking about? Also stealing is not a Hostile, and given that MA target-shared Sanc ally, so what if Sanc steals from them during a notice period. Get real. I love how you say Sanc had it coming because they got noticed by Pew Pew, yet MA didnt when they had even more advanced notice.

In short - BS BS BS we are di*s BS BS BS dont complain cuz we 2v1 and 3v1 u BS BS BS U cant do anything about it BS BS BS. And about the part that i havent been rnd when Mehul was on i say this - Hhehee keep telling urself that :D If u believe it it may become true :)

[Crazy Pete]

Well theres a few what ifs to this storey for sure.

I think had Sanctuary not stolen from ELit and AMA had waved Sanctuary then you could say Elit was running. Hard to say after the fact, definatley have to respond vs kd thiefing you at a large scale. I also think ELit was planning on a big explore of a few provs to get the upper hand vs Havoc.

Big part of the problem is kd's can't explore up provinces fast enough after wars to avoid vulturing to match kd's that explore up while you're in war (killers etc.) Flogger had some good ideas but there in lies the problem with being able to effectively compete vs kd's watching and pumping killers as you war to outnumber you.

Fix that problem with the game mechanics and make it possible to war/pump/war and the game will be better all the way around, and skill not timing will in you crowns.

[PhoenixScorpion]

In short - BS BS BS we are di*s BS BS BS dont complain cuz we 2v1 and 3v1 u BS BS BS U cant do anything about it BS BS BS. And about the part that i havent been rnd when Mehul was on i say this - Hhehee keep telling urself that :D If u believe it it may become true :)

You sound like a second grader....

[PhoenixScorpion]

Well theres a few what ifs to this storey for sure.

I think had Sanctuary not stolen from ELit and AMA had waved Sanctuary then you could say Elit was running. Hard to say after the fact, definatley have to respond vs kd thiefing you at a large scale. I also think ELit was planning on a big explore of a few provs to get the upper hand vs Havoc.

Big part of the problem is kd's can't explore up provinces fast enough after wars to avoid vulturing to match kd's that explore up while you're in war (killers etc.) Flogger had some good ideas but there in lies the problem with being able to effectively compete vs kd's watching and pumping killers as you war to outnumber you.

Fix that problem with the game mechanics and make it possible to war/pump/war and the game will be better all the way around, and skill not timing will in you crowns.

Nice post ;)

[shakenbridge]

In short - BS BS BS we are di*s BS BS BS dont complane cuz we 2v1 3v1 u BS BS BS U cant do anything about it BS BS BS. And about the part that i havent been rnd when Mehul was on i say this - Hhehee keep telling urself that :D If u believe it it may become true :)

...ow. Can you prove that it's not BS? Taking your current approach hasn't worked out well for you at all.

You sound like a second grader....

This. +1

[guard14n]

You sound like a second grader....

If a second grader can see through ur BS then u either upgrade the level of "I have nothing to say so i will just troll" esse or stop saying stupid things at all mate :D

And i wish i was second grade! It was fun then. I hope u were at least born when i was in second grade tho :D

...ow. Can you prove that it's not BS? Taking your current approach hasn't worked out well for you at all.



This. +1

Yey u dont like me ! Im famous ! :)